Another mass shooting

svtfocus2cobra

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Get what you are saying, but sounds like bs to me. You get your ass in there and engage with him asap. Will some be hit. Maybe and probably. I am not an expert, but where are these successes with the mentally deranged using this tactic? Just haven’t seen it. I have however seen old church people fight off attackers throwing books.

Just seems you have to fight. And fight immediatelYaya!
One person barricaded in a room has the tactical advantage even when facing a team of trained shooters. It's because being in a school type building most rooms have only one entrance and that CQB team each have to cross that threshold which we call the fatal funnel. If you are barricaded in a room with cover you can just set your sites on the doorway and blast anyone who comes through. Even if they don't get killed they will become combat ineffective and yet another casualty. CQB operations have an 83% casualty rate which makes it easily one of the most dangerous operations you can conduct. That is why you have to have coordinated fire and in this scenario you would likely have to have a designated marksman trying to cover the team through the windows of the room as they make entrance or you have to blow a hole in a wall of a conjoined room to gain another angle of attack that the person then has to engage. When doing our final training scenario for CQB school we did force on force operations in a school and with two instructors barricaded in a room they were able to take out all 12 of us who tried to make entry. We never even got two feet into the room. When you have kids possibly in the room as well it removes options like breaching walls and your DM has to be able to have eyes on the target to try and get an angle that the team can't get. Anyone who has learned CQB or been through the course will tell you that it takes an entirely different level of understanding than what you initially believe.
 
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Rb0891

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One person barricaded in a room has the tactical advantage even when facing a team of trained shooters. It's because being in a school type building most rooms have only one entrance and that CQB team each have to cross that threshold. If you are barricaded in a room with cover you can just set your sites on the doorway and blast anyone who comes through. Even if they don't get killed they will become combat ineffective and yet another casualty. CQB operations have an 83% casualty rate which makes it easily one of the most dangerous operations you can conduct. That is why you have to have coordinated fire and in this scenario you would likely have to have a designated marksman trying to cover the team through the windows of the room as they make entrance or you have to blow a hole in a wall of a conjointly room to gain another angle of attack that the person then has to engage. When doing our final training scenario for CQB school we did force on force operations in a school and with two instructors barricaded in a room they were able to take out all 12 of us who tried to make entry. We never even got Teo feet into the room. When you have kids possibly in the room as well it removes options like breaching walls and your DM has to be able to have eyes on the target to try and get an angle that the team can't get. Anyone who has learned CQB or been through the course will tell you that it takes an entirely different level of understanding than what you initially believe.
Very well, but if this is the best we can expect, we need to go a lot farther than discussing fing locked metal doors.

Why was the border patrol guy so effective?
 

Blown 89

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Who the **** is talking about abandoning the facility, creating caos and going willy? Lol
The video showed parents complaining to a cop holding the perimeter that he should run in and do something and not hold people outside so......
 

svtfocus2cobra

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Very well, but if this is the best we can expect, we need to go a lot farther than discussing fing locked metal doors.

Why was the border patrol guy so effective?

From my understanding the BP was an actual CQB team. They crossed the threshold and the agent that dropped him was likely the one, two, or three man in the stack and had the first angle on the target so he made the kill while taking a shot in the leg.

I agree that the easiest method is the secure the damn schools and each individual room. So many deaths could have been prevented with basic security measures.
 

ZYBORG

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The video showed parents complaining to a cop holding the perimeter that he should run in and do something and not hold people outside so......

So because you saw some video of some guy, you decided that I was endorsing the abandoning of the school, creating caos and going willy?

nah man…. Not even close
 

Bullitt1448

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This was not a hostage situation where LEO negotiates with the perp, this was an active shooter situation. Taking an hour to enter the school is indefensible. Those were 10 yr old kids in there, completely defenceless. There were roughly 100 LEO on scene that have at least some training and were armed not to mention that they are paid to put their lives in the line every day. I see this as a massive black eye for LEO if the news reports are anywhere near accurate. I am not anti LEO but how would you feel if it was your kid in that room and you see 100armed and trained men sitting on their hands while the shooter is in a classroom killing 10 Yr old kids?
 

Blown 89

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So because you saw some video of some guy, you decided that I was endorsing the abandoning of the school, creating caos and going willy?

nah man…. Not even close
Ok man, keep on armchair quarterbacking then.
 

HudsonFalcon

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How about we take some of the $40 billion congress is trying to launder in Ukraine and, I don’t know, give it to law enforcement here?

I know a lot of schools have resource officers of sheriffs stationed in them at all times.

I propose something along the same lines but taken up a notch.

Put the local police department or sheriff sub-station inside the school. All towns, villages, communities, etc. have police stations and schools. Combine the two buildings.
 

VenomousDSG

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Very damaging story if true... mother tells cops to go in and help kids or she will. Gets tackled and handcuffed, then released a couple minutes later. She then runs in herself and rescues her own kids.

Other reports of cops tackling and pepper spraying other parents for trying to get their kids while they still did nothing.

 

lOOKnGO

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What's this tell you. I know what it tells me. Public schools are the problem. Home school or private.
Screenshot_20220526-195803_Samsung%20Internet.jpeg


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VRYALT3R3D

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There was someone carrying a rifle right outside of a school today but thankfully the cops put him down within minutes of responding. Maybe a copycat?


RIP to those kids in Texas. Banning guns will do nothing. If these proposed gun laws are supposed to stop or prevent a horrible event from occurring, did these laws actually work? Will more firearm regulations make society safer? If lawmakers cannot demonstrate this, then any promise is hollow and posturing.
 

cobracide

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What's this tell you. I know what it tells me. Public schools are the problem. Home school or private.View attachment 1749746

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The data in of itself tells you nothing.

You have to normalize the data over the percentage of schools private vs public. Private is ten percent.
Normalizing we have 60 private to 84 public so approx 6:8 or
3 private school shootings to 4 public school shootings by ratio.
 

lOOKnGO

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Kind of skewed stats though... There are a hell of a lot more public schools than private schools. And the amount of students in an average private school are a fraction of those in a public school.
Yep, smaller is better. Run the numbers any way you wish. Kids are safer in private schools. Why do you think people of affluence that route.
 

VenomousDSG

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Yep, smaller is better. Run the numbers any way you wish. Kids are safer in private schools. Why do you think people of affluence that route.
No argument from me on that one. Smaller town, smaller school, I'm all for it...

All the problems of this country seem to stem from major cities and the lunacy that is created in them. Politics and all.
 

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