Any structural engineers/home builders

[ff500]

I was hoping to get some opinions on an issue with our new home being built. I had my pre drywall inspection on thursday. We started on the second floor and worked our way down to the basement, everything looked good until we got to the mechanical room.The project manager says your probably wondering what that grey patch line is in the foundation, honestly I didn't even notice it.

Apparently during the backfill, the back hoe got to close to the house and cracked the foundation, there was a crack line from the basement floor all the way up to the basement window and another crack on the exterior. They repaired the crack with an epoxy injection after being looked at by a structural engineer. My wife and I don't know what to do, we both feel like the house will have a flaw before we even settle on it, and we could eventually have other problems because of this. I do have a pic of the patched crack I'll post if there's anyone with experience in these matters.

 

[Blackedout]

Post some pics... Like so see how wide the crack is ??? What side is cracked front?? rear ??? post some pics or the exterior around the house... which way does the ground slope ??? any plan to finish the basement ??

 

[ff500]

I can't tell how wide the crack is because they sealed it before my walk through. The basement will be finished except for the mechanical room. The exterior patch would be the top right side of the first photo. The long diagonal crack is completely through the 8" foundation, it slightly bowed in but they somehow repaired.

The cracks are in the front right side of the house, I plan on taking more pictures of the exterior patch tomorrow

 

[tistan]

I build, but we don't have basements where I am. If the block on the foundations one of our houses cracked I would not be worried. Due to hurricane code, we have to tie a block foundation together with more re bar than a freaking skyscraper, and then all of our block is poured solid.


Why is that piece of trim between the two upstairs windows not centered?

 

[oldmodman]

What would make me worry is the fact that a backhoe bumping into an 8" poured concrete wall would break it. I have tried to bust up old foundations and they are VERY hard to break.

I would probably pay to have an engineer, not associated with the company, drill a core sample and have the strength of the concrete tested. And then have him determine if the "patch job" is sufficient to insure the stability of your house. If it isn't just walk away from that house and buy another one.

 

[ff500]

It looks like he probably couldn't reach the top window so he just screwed it in so he wouldn't lose it until they side the house.

 

[ff500]

What would make me worry is the fact that a backhoe bumping into an 8" poured concrete wall would break it. I have tried to bust up old foundations and they are VERY hard to break.

I would probably pay to have an engineer, not associated with the company, drill a core sample and have the strength of the concrete tested. And then have him determine if the "patch job" is sufficient to insure the stability of your house. If it isn't just walk away from that house and buy another one.

I would love to walk away and buy another but this is toll brothers and their contracts are iron clad.
I do plan on having another engineer look at it and I'm also going to call the building inspector on Monday, he signed off on the repair.

 

[Squamishcoyote]

Please tell me you're getting pot lights in your soffit. Would be sad to see such a nice house lose out on that

 

[Mr. Mach-ete]

That looks like a future issue to me. House settles, crack gets wider, don't trust that epoxy as a solution. Tell the home builder your hiring an independent structural engineer to evaluate the crack and your sending them the bill.

 

[fast ford brian]

I wouldn't tell the contractor anything until you get another opinion . Structural epoxy is a pretty common thing to use . I just don't know about on a basement wall crack like that .

 

[Blackedout]

That is CRAZZZZY... Get a pic of the machine they used to back fill with... The operator must have been using the bucket to compact the dirt around the foundation... how long has the foundation been poured??

 

[ff500]

That is CRAZZZZY... Get a pic of the machine they used to back fill with... The operator must have been using the bucket to compact the dirt around the foundation... how long has the foundation been poured??

The foundation was poured about 2 months ago, the damage was repaired on 6/20 and signed off on 6/21 by the local building inspector and an engineer out of Wash DC. I did not know there was any damage until Thursday when I did my walk through, you think they would have notified us.

The father in law is an attorney and he says not to worry about it because there is a 10 year structural warranty on the house. Regardless, I'm not happy about it.

 

[Blackedout]

They were probably going to insulate the basement and you would never even know.... :bash: PM sent

 

[jcthorne]

I would ask for a concession from the builder. A future inspection at time of next sale is going to notice and value of the house IS effected. If they are not willing to accept a cost concession for the damage, perhaps they would consider insulating the mechanical room so the crack is not visible on first inspection.

It may be structually sound but if I was inspecting the house considering buying it, it would have to be FAR below market value to even consider with that kind of foundation repair.

 

[7998]

Actually the epoxy injections do work. Sometimes poured concrete walls crack due to expansion or settlement. My main concern would be the waterproofing.
I would demand that the damaged wall is re-waterproofed using a oll-on rubber membrane.
I have worked for Toll, Orleans, K Hov, and a bunch others. In this economy they will give you a rim job to get you to the closing table. They're profit margins are around 30%, so there is definitely an upgrade in your future if you are assertive.
Personally I would be very upset. I know that the epoxy does work and with the extra waterproofing I could probably sleep at night. But I would still have to look at the crack for 30 years or more.
Don't buy into that "These contracts are iron clad", that's bull shit.
They're not and you don't have to sign nothing.
Let me tell you something about Building inspectors, some of them are crooked. Usually a couple sets of Eagles tickets on the 50 yard line bought a lot of signatures from B.I's.

What would make me worry is the fact that a backhoe bumping into an 8" poured concrete wall would break it. I have tried to bust up old foundations and they are VERY hard to break.

I would probably pay to have an engineer, not associated with the company, drill a core sample and have the strength of the concrete tested. And then have him determine if the "patch job" is sufficient to insure the stability of your house. If it isn't just walk away from that house and buy another one.

Actually it is easier than you think to crack one especially when the walls are unloaded (no frame on top or dirt against). On long straight walls I would sometimes have to brace them until the frame was on because a good rain storm would make the dirt heavy enough to pop the wall.

 

[mustangmike1]

I am a home builder in Canada and if something like this happened to us an engineer could make us brace it. I would have to see it up close but if the crack was bad enough and the wall has come in a bit I would have the foundation braced on each side of the window, epoxy should be injected from the exterior and then interior followed by a moisture proof membrane like blue skin on the entire exterior of the cracked wall. The braces will be 5-6" metal I beams that run through the floor slab and up to the side of the floor joist. May sound like overkill but it's your new home.

The pressure on a foundation wall after a good rain or from poor run off is crazy high, it will just push that point in more and that is what you want to prevent. We don't backfill within 2 weeks or without the floor structure on to prevent this from happening. I would have a reputable contractor that braces foundation walls check it out especially if it has come in a bit.

 

[CobraBob]

A lot of very good advice posted here. You should NOT just accept this repair as being "sufficient" and "properly done". Have your own professional experts examine the crack and the repair. Determine if the crack/repair will affect your home value. And then if you are not satisfied with what you're hearing, sit down with Toll Bros. and make some demands. After all, you are investing a lot of money into your home. You want to be absolutely certain that the repair was properly done and compensated for any future value loss. I can tell you that if you were selling that house and I was a potential buyer, I'd be very concerned about that crack and would likely walk away. Toll Bros. needs to insure that you are satisfied 100% with the repair and that you will have no future issues with it, including down valuing of your home. JMO.

FYI, my wife and I were looking at buying a home in a large Toll Bros. complex nearby. A friend of mine is a contractor and was telling us how some building shortcuts were overlooked by town building officials. Some officials are less honest/professional that others, trust me.

 

[ff500]

I gave our real estate attorney a call yesterday and I am waiting on a call back from him. I also put a call into their engineer, he stamped the repair but no call back of as yet. I plan on calling the local building inspector today. I am trying to get as much in writing as possible to cover our us.

 

[black92]

Beautiful home and that does suck to see. Hopefully it's a one time issue that isn't anything major. I also agree that if you can get some exterior lighting installed, it would be well worth it.

Not to give you nightmares, but a neighbor of mine bought a new house and whatever the builder did, they must have done wrong. He has at least 15 cracks like the from top to bottom throughout his basement and has had them repaired similar to yours and his house is 5-6 years old...

 

[Digital]

We don't have basements here as we're at sea level so usually just footers are poured here and not walls. I have seen multiple huge jobs get delayed though in extremely large pours or high rises because the PSI samples post-pour weren't up to snuff.

While it could have been a freak accident that the front end loader nailed it just right it could also be a combination of that or a bad pour. I wouldn't take their word on it, there was a ton of CYA in all the major jobs I was involved in. Shit would randomly go wrong on one side of the job and suddenly no one was over there and hadn't been "all day."

Also as was said the GC does well very, better then the trades on the job in some instances, they got the money to make it right, and in this sue happy country I'm sure they will be more then willing to work with you once you have some ammunition and a expectation on what you want them to do.
Many times we've had to re-do or change order shit because a customer was just a dick and pushed around a weak GC. You actually have a legit issue. Once you cut that check they got you by the balls, and there's nothing a GC hates more then a job that's ground to a halt, so speak up while you have the chance.

Also just out of curiosity sake did they give you a option that wasn't CPVC?