Header Question

[IronTerp]

Do you guys think long tube headers are worth the price? And I have heard to use AR or Kooks. JBAs look about the same?

Added long tubes and a 10% lower over the winter. Getting a tune tweak and dyno numbers next week. Will post up the results.

Is it worth it?? I'm still reeling from the cost. And most certainly never told my wife.....

$1,050 for new ARH w/ catless X pipe
$275 for ceramic coating
$450 for install
$1,775 total

 

[Willie]

.... And most certainly never told my wife.....

We have a mutual understanding..... Don't ask, don't tell.... Guilt by omission, others may say, but it seems to work for us... LOL...

 

[me32]

When was the last time that you have heard of JBA quality issues? I remember quality issues before Pertronix bought them, but that was 6-8 years ago, in fact Pertronox had me send back an X-Pipe that I had bought from Shelby as part of the full 3" Super Snake 700 exhaust system, but there was no issue with the replacement they sent.

^^^If fact Pertronix did not even have to replace the pipe that I bought from JBA before they owned the brand, especially when it had not been purchased direct, but instead through Shelby. They stood behind it........Pretty good customer service. I have not heard any recent complaints about JBA, recent being in the past 6+ years....

...........and I believe JBA has spent the extra bucks to get the CARB EO for the 2007-2014 GT500 shorty's, but I have not heard any install feedback.

R

Buddy of mine actually last year just bought a brand new jba O/R for his mach 1. Quality is so bad it leaks where is mounts to the stock manifolds even with a new ford OEM gasket. He swapped to a bassani X pipe and now no more leak. So not sure what things jba quality decided to fix but clearly isnt across the board.

 

[Robert M]

FRPP hard to get... Used set for sale.. Dunno if they sold:

https://www.svtperformance.com/threads/frpp-shorty-headers.1172727/#post-16162960

New ceramic set on Ebay:

NEW OEM Ford Performance Shorty Headers Coated M-9430-C54C Mustang 5.4 V8 07-09 | eBay

Tob's post:
https://www.svtperformance.com/thre...the-discontinued-frpp-shorty-headers.1037985/

Apparently Carb EO #D-308-13


GL

Here is the C.A.R.B. exemption mentioned above........

Nothing about FRPP headers or exhaust mods......

R

 

[Robert M]

Buddy of mine actually last year just bought a brand new jba O/R for his mach 1. Quality is so bad it leaks where is mounts to the stock manifolds even with a new ford OEM gasket. He swapped to a bassani X pipe and now no more leak. So not sure what things jba quality decided to fix but clearly isnt across the board.

Then that IS sad if the quality has not improved across the board with their products.

I currently have the FRPP shorty's on my 2008 along with the full 3" JBA exhaust that was offered through Shelby a few years ago. After getting the original X-pipe swapped out, I have had no issues.

R

 

[Totalpkg]

Here is the C.A.R.B. exemption mentioned above........

View attachment 1565257

Nothing about FRPP headers or exhaust mods......

R

Yup no mention of the headers in the Carb NO, but on the drag pack is listed as '50-States Street Legal'

Hopefully this helps...

 

[Totalpkg]

Then that IS sad if the quality has not improved across the board with their products.


I currently have the FRPP shorty's on my 2008 along with the full 3" JBA exhaust that was offered through Shelby a few years ago. After getting the original X-pipe swapped out, I have had no issues.


R

Did you install the FRPP shorty's? I heard its a pain in a$$. What version of FRPP shorties do you have because apparently they were updated.

 

[Totalpkg]

Delete.

 

[Totalpkg]

Delete.

 

[Robert M]

Yup no mention of the headers in the Carb NO, but on the drag pack is listed as '50-States Street Legal'

Hopefully this helps...

Yes, I saw that picture also from Tob's thread..........but in the end, if that set-up was on a Calif. car and the CARB EO was even slightly researched, would it pass?

To me it looks like Ford got a CARB EO for the CAI, and then attempted to pile (or hide) everything else under that CAI CARB EO, which would not fly if a little bit of research were to be done. Looking at the list above, everything else would probably work fine in Calif. and not be an issue when used with that CAI......."except" that exhaust change, that becomes an issue real quick in Calif.

R

 

[Robert M]

Did you install the FRPP shorty's? I heard its a pain in a$$. What version of FRPP shorties do you have because apparently they were updated.

I had a friend who has a 2-post lift do them. It was a PITA. I guess they are the later version, ceramic coated. I spent the extra $$$ on the quality Ford oem manifold gaskets and stage 8 header bolts, I did not want any leaks. They have been on my car for about 8 years with no issues. Putting those FRPP shorty's on my car, along with the full 3" exhaust really woke my car up!

I think most owners "back in the day" installed those FRPP shorty's with the oem 2.5" exhaust behind them, with maybe only a catback change? I would guess that not much performance increase would be realized with that set up?

R

 

[tvspower]

Then that IS sad if the quality has not improved across the board with their products.

I currently have the FRPP shorty's on my 2008 along with the full 3" JBA exhaust that was offered through Shelby a few years ago. After getting the original X-pipe swapped out, I have had no issues.

R

Robert. Is there much gain with shorties

 

[me32]

Did you install the FRPP shorty's? I heard its a pain in a$$. What version of FRPP shorties do you have because apparently they were updated.

I had mine installed from a shop. I had the original ones from the kit that had ceramic coated stock. They said it was a pain in the ass and they had to trim something on the driver side to clear. The updated last revision fixed that issue. It definitely changed the tone of the exhaust in a good way and seemed to rev smoother/quicker. But that could be all in my head.

 

[me32]

Yes, I saw that picture also from Tob's thread..........but in the end, if that set-up was on a Calif. car and the CARB EO was even slightly researched, would it pass?

To me it looks like Ford got a CARB EO for the CAI, and then attempted to pile (or hide) everything else under that CAI CARB EO, which would not fly if a little bit of research were to be done. Looking at the list above, everything else would probably work fine in Calif. and not be an issue when used with that CAI......."except" that exhaust change, that becomes an issue real quick in Calif.

R

From the info i got from Ford racing its like they gave up on finishing the CARB approval because the FRPP ended up with 2 different CARB numbers. But the one listed was suppose to be for the full drag pack kit.

 

[Robert M]

Robert. Is there much gain with shorties

I have never had my car on a dyno, so actual "quoted" numbers are unavailable from me. All I can say is that with the shorty's added and the full 3" Shelby/JBA exhaust, my 5.4 spins up much faster than with the previous log manifolds, oem 2.5" catted X and 2.5" Borla Touring (Shelby installed the Borla Touring as part of the Super Snake upgrade). With the shorty's and the full 3", there is definitely a seat of the pants feel/increase in acceleration with my car.

How much of it is the shorty's? and how much of it is the full 3"? IDK, but with all of it installed, there was/is a noticeable difference in the way my car performs.

R

 

[tvspower]

I have never had my car on a dyno, so actual "quoted" numbers are unavailable from me. All I can say is that with the shorty's added and the full 3" Shelby/JBA exhaust, my 5.4 spins up much faster than with the previous log manifolds, oem 2.5" catted X and 2.5" Borla Touring (Shelby installed the Borla Touring as part of the Super Snake upgrade). With the shorty's and the full 3", there is definitely a seat of the pants feel/increase in acceleration with my car.

How much of it is the shorty's? and how much of it is the full 3"? IDK, but with all of it installed, there was/is a noticeable difference in the way my car performs.

R

Thank you

 

[RedVenom48]

My apologies to everyone. I called Ford Performance on 4/12/19 (today) and they confirmed they were NOT 50 state legal on their own. As mentioned by @Totalpkg when used with the now unavailable SVT drag pack P/N: M-2007-FR2SVT they were 50 state. My guess is that they were similar to how the Whipple 2.9 was 50 state legal when used with the FRPP calibration that came with the kit. No included FRPP calibration, no legal in California.

It now appears that the JBA shorties are the only 50 state option.

Now where is Full Boogie to rub this in my face? Miss you boo...

 

[Robert M]

My apologies to everyone. I called Ford Performance on 4/12/19 (today) and they confirmed they were NOT 50 state legal on their own. As mentioned by @Totalpkg when used with the now unavailable SVT drag pack P/N: M-2007-FR2SVT they were 50 state. My guess is that they were similar to how the Whipple 2.9 was 50 state legal when used with the FRPP calibration that came with the kit. No included FRPP calibration, no legal in California.

It now appears that the JBA shorties are the only 50 state option.

Now where is Full Boogie to rub this in my face? Miss you boo...

No need to apologize, this FRPP info. is confusing as it relates to the FRPP shorty's.

Did the 2.9 Whipple (when used with the FRPP) kit also include an exhaust change at the cylinder heads, like shorty's or long tubes? or was it the 2.9 S/C and FRPP tune as "the kit"?

The 2.8KB and 3.6LC KB are also 50 state legal, but they did not include changes ahead of the catback. The 725 Super Snake (back in 2007-2009) was 50 state legal with the rusty log manifolds and no changes ahead of the catback. The newer 3.6LC 800 and 850 horse Super Snakes are also 50 state legal, but all oem exhaust ahead of the catback.

R

 

[RedVenom48]

No need to apologize, this FRPP info. is confusing as it relates to the FRPP shorty's.

Did the 2.9 Whipple (when used with the FRPP) kit also include an exhaust change at the cylinder heads, like shorty's or long tubes? or was it the 2.9 S/C and FRPP tune as "the kit"?

The 2.8KB and 3.6LC KB are also 50 state legal, but they did not include changes ahead of the catback. The 725 Super Snake (back in 2007-2009) was 50 state legal with the rusty log manifolds and no changes ahead of the catback. The newer 3.6LC 800 and 850 horse Super Snakes are also 50 state legal, but all oem exhaust ahead of the catback.

R

looks like the FRPP Whipple kit was no exhaust modifications, save for the 2.9 Crusher specific EGR tube. Intake, TB, plugs and an upgraded drop in Fuel Pump assy were the only other things included along with the calibration.

2011-2012
https://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-ra...MI6qTa-6TL4QIVUSCtBh1n2AeDEAQYASABEgIxsPD_BwE

2007-2010
https://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-ra...black-wrinkle-gt500-2007-2010/p/M6066MSVT29C/

 

[Robert M]

looks like the FRPP Whipple kit was no exhaust modifications, save for the 2.9 Crusher specific EGR tube. Intake, TB, plugs and an upgraded drop in Fuel Pump assy were the only other things included along with the calibration.

2011-2012
https://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-ra...MI6qTa-6TL4QIVUSCtBh1n2AeDEAQYASABEgIxsPD_BwE

2007-2010
https://www.cjponyparts.com/ford-ra...black-wrinkle-gt500-2007-2010/p/M6066MSVT29C/

Yes, it has always been the change ahead of the catback to the oem exhaust that sends up red flags in CA. and probably a few other states now. That drag pack from Ford claimed CARB EO, but the actual CA. CARB EO information mentioned nothing about any other changes except the CAI. My guess is that if a car would enter an emissions inspection in CA., and the CARB EO was researched/verified for the specifics of that CARB EO, that car would fail emissions (probably the visual) with FRPP shorty's.........not because of the FRPP claim for the drag pack parts, but instead the CA. CARB EO specific's which do not include those shorty's.

I don't know how long that drag pack was offered through FRPP.........maybe it was discontinued for just that reason, it was claiming something that was not certified. <<This would also be an issue for someone who purchased a drag pack from FRPP, installed all items and then their car failed emissions inspection in CA.............Who is this owner going to put a claim against first?.......Ford/FRPP.

It is really too bad, because the FRPP shorty's are nice and they seem to be of decent quality. The ceramic coat on mine still looks Great and they don't leak..........and best of all, they look a heck of a lot better than rusty manifolds.

R