Mach 1 Vortech Belt Issue

[blownstang4.6]

Not sure if this will help you, but took a pic of my belt and tensor this weekend when working on the car. 3.12 pulley and stock crank pulley. No problems and no belt slip. Could probably fit one size smaller belt on it still. So 112.5-113" effective length is what you'd want for your setup. Effective length of my belt is 111.06".

 

[01yellercobra]

Well the belt ripped a rib off and jumped forward on a few of the pulleys again. I drove it around cruising and everything was all good. On the way home last night I decided to try to get on it a little bit and see what would happen and it’s pretty clear that what I changed didn’t fix the problem.. Obviously my laser alignment didn’t work or something. I’ll take some pictures in a little bit.....

DSG, The radiator hose was pulled up for extra room installing the piping and supercharger. It doesn’t stay like that! Lol

When you say forward do you mean towards the front of the car? I'm just asking to clarify. If you look at the blower pulley pic you can see the belt riding closer to the blower side of the pulley. I would check the alternator alignment for that. And it's been a long time, but isn't there a ribbed pulley on that side of the timing cover as well? I remember having to add a shim under a pulley on that side to get things aligned correctly.

I used a laser alignment tool and found one of my pullies was half a rib width off. It was enough to cause all kinds of issues.

FWIW, I ran the Thump tensioner on my 01 Cobra with the F1A and once I got things aligned it never shredded a belt or slipped. And I didn't need two people to put the belt on. All tight belts do is kill main bearings.

 

[JGDogg10]

Do you remember how much you shimmed the pulley out? I’m almost positive that the ribbed idler pulley that has no lips on it and is under the supercharger bracket is the problem. I started the car and watched the belt, and the belt stays on the correct position on every pulley except for that pulley. It looks like the belt on that pulley is one rib jumped forward. I’m thinking maybe that one needs to be shimmed out?

 

[DSG2003Mach1]

sounds like it

 

[01yellercobra]

Do you remember how much you shimmed the pulley out? I’m almost positive that the ribbed idler pulley that has no lips on it and is under the supercharger bracket is the problem. I started the car and watched the belt, and the belt stays on the correct position on every pulley except for that pulley. It looks like the belt on that pulley is one rib jumped forward. I’m thinking maybe that one needs to be shimmed out?

I don't remember. It was a few years ago. I do remember it was a flat washer I had on the bench. It wasn't anything special.

 

[JGDogg10]

So i noticed I had an oil leak on the car. I just replaced the seals in the supercharger and was concerned it was that, but I looked deeper and it turns out it looks like it’s coming from my front crank seal. The oil will pool up in the bolt hole and when I start the car it flings oil all down on the ground in a line. The car sat for a year before I just got it running, so could it be that the seal is just dried out and leaking? The other night the belt started constantly squeeking while I was driving, and then when I’d rev the car it would make a loud squeal. Not sure if the belt is too big now? This is a pain in the ass to chase down what’s going on.

I’m thinking I will start by aligning the idler pulley that seems off, then fix the oil leak, then put my thump tensioner back on and use the same longer belt that only has 7 ribs on parts of the belt to make sure the belt won’t jump forward. And if the belt still squeaks then I will switch back to the shorter belt... thoughts?

 

[JGDogg10]

Damn this car fights against me on every little thing lol. I installed my thump tensioner back on, shimmed out the aluminum idler pulley on the passenger side, the power steering and flipped the idler pulley on the triangle bracket to get a better surface for the belt. I trimmed off all the frayed edges of the belt and basically made it a 7 rib belt so that I didn’t have to keep buying belt after belt just to test it.
I started and drive the car last night and the belt looked to be much more smooth while it was idling. I set the belt so that the “good” edge of the belt was on the rib closest to the engine on all pulleys. I drove the car pretty hard without having anything snap or rip, which is the first time in a long time. But when I got home, the belt was in the right spot on all pulleys except for the crank this time! Wtf. The belt jumped a rib forward on just the crank pulley.... makes no sense.
The only thing I can think of, is maybe you were right about the water pump pulley and when the belt is getting tightened it pushes up on that edge on the pulley and is forcing it forward?? Or the oil leaking from the crank seal is making the belt move around?? I’ll post pics soon

Sorry for the long posts, just want to be able to drive this thing the way it should be!

 

[old01cobra]

You were right on the alternator and supercharger. Mine is idling fine at this time haven’t driven it yet. But I do notice my tensioner is bouncing like a mofo and I think it’s knocking at times. I do have lopy cams in it. Anyone else experience a periodic knock in the tensioner area below the blower?

 

[JGDogg10]

So I’m pretty sure that you were right all along about the water pump pulley! When I first installed the belt and from what i remembered the belt was good onnthat pulley, however after close inspection now that a rib was cut off, the now 7 rib belt is right up against that lip on the water pump pulley. I’ll post a pic and you can see the belt up against that lip. I also think that this is why it pulled the belt a rib forward(towards the radiator) onnthe crank pulley. Did you machine the entire lip off or did you leave a small lip at the end to catch the belt from sliding all the way off?

 

[1996MysticSnake]

Isn't you water pump pulley smooth without ribs?

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[JGDogg10]

Yes, but the belt is riding up on the lip of the water pump pulley. In the pic you can see the ribs of the belt facing out as it wraps around the water pump pulley.

 

[01yellercobra]

When I did the 8 rib I used a pulley from an F150 with a tall water pump. That one didn't have the ribs one the ends.

 

[1996MysticSnake]

Yeah I was gonna say my 96 doesn't have a lip on the outside away from the motor. I've never had belt issues with my vortech.

I'm pretty sure all those vortech kits are supposed to be used with water pump pulleys that don't have the lip.

I know for a fact the 96-98 directions say that if you have that outer lip on that pulley you need to get one that doesn't.

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[JGDogg10]

Ya the GI Joe kit sent a spacer for that pulley, but it’s not spaced out enough. And if you space it out too far, the belt will fall off the back side(block side) of the pulley.

 

[01yellercobra]

It's been a while since I messed with the 8 rib swap. But I don't see how theres enough room on the stock pulley for an 8 rib belt.

I'm pretty sure this is the pulley I ran:
FORD OEM Water Pump-Pulley F6TZ8509AA | eBay

 

[JGDogg10]

Yes that pulley will work for the long snout water pump, unfortunately I have the short snout!

And Bob is that you? Lol.

 

[1996MysticSnake]

I wonder if you can just swap pumps?

There's enough room for an 8 rib on it. It's close but it fits.

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[01yellercobra]

Yes that pulley will work for the long snout water pump, unfortunately I have the short snout!

And Bob is that you? Lol.

Umm....yes it is...

I wonder if you can just swap pumps?

There's enough room for an 8 rib on it. It's close but it fits.

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The long water pump will swap right in for the short pump. I found out on accident. I picked up a replacement pump from Autozone and I didn't realize it was a long pump until I had it installed on my engine and the pulley wouldn't line up. I threw the 8 rib pulley on and it worked fine for about 20k miles.

 

[JGDogg10]

Hey Bob! it’s Justin from SoCalStangs. With the red Mach 1, and I had the green 96 GT. We installed my vortech kit at Wayne’s house with Emerson!

Anyway, I’m having the lip machined off at the shop on Saturday. My fiancé’s dad manages the shop and will do it for free, so I’ll try that and then switch to the long snout water pump if that doesn’t work.

On a side note, I heard a strange noise in the rear of the car, found dripping gear oil out of a hole in the diff cover! Drained everything and there were two bolts from the ring gear in the bottom of the rear end. The rest of the bolts were halfway threaded out or hand tight. Awesome right?! Lol

 

[01yellercobra]

Hey Bob! it’s Justin from SoCalStangs. With the red Mach 1, and I had the green 96 GT. We installed my vortech kit at Wayne’s house with Emerson!

Anyway, I’m having the lip machined off at the shop on Saturday. My fiancé’s dad manages the shop and will do it for free, so I’ll try that and then switch to the long snout water pump if that doesn’t work.

On a side note, I heard a strange noise in the rear of the car, found dripping gear oil out of a hole in the diff cover! Drained everything and there were two bolts from the ring gear in the bottom of the rear end. The rest of the bolts were halfway threaded out or hand tight. Awesome right?! Lol

What's up dude? When was the last time that car ran? The last time we ran into each other you were still having issues.

Is it a full machine shop? Can they make something from scratch?