Ported Eaton vs Twin Screw at Stock Boost

[BadAzztt]

Ryushin your missing one VERY important detail...you live at 6500 ft. The chances of you putting a hurt on your motor up here is pretty slim!

When my car dyno'd 494 SAE it was actually putting 380 to the wheels up here. If you pully an eaton for 19lbs up here you will probably see 13-14, if you pully a Whipple for 13 you will see 9-10. No matter what; when you dyno 500 up here you will actually see less than 400 actual HP and run mid 12's. Like I said the chances of you hurting you motor...not likely. Welcome to running a car a mile high.

As far as any of your warranty ideas go, it's not likely anything will be covered once you pull off the blower. It's possible if you go to a Ford dealer and get it done they will cover it but I don't think we have any around here who would.

Easiest way to add HP up here is drive to sea level, lol. Good luck in your quest!

 

[BadAzztt]

Oh and I would nix the knock sensor idea for these motors. I have run many turbo cars and always considered it a good idea myself but I always hear bad things about installing them on these motors. These motors tend to be noisy so it constantly pulls timing and ruins performance. I know what your thinking..turn the sensitivity down... well everyone I know who has done that has had to turn it down so low that it rendered the sensor useless.

I would listen to most on this site as they have been at it for a while, 14-17lbs of boost on these motors is not a problem, regardless of blower.

 

[Ryushin]

I read both of the links you provided and could not find that info. Whipple doesn't provide anything for less than 13lbs of boost and the other author said flat out that the roots blower has low end advantages over the twin screw. He also went on to say that under equal conditions the twin screw outperforms the roots in peak hp primarily by making MORE BOOST :shrug: He also said beware of info being provided by someone with financial stake in the matter. Did you read his entire page?

Yea I read it, and that was one of the whole reasons why I started this thread. According to that, the Eaton does quite well with low boost. I was going to try and find some independent information that would corroborate the graph. I usually hear bad quotes about the KB dyno's and and other misinformation. I haven't heard anything bad about Whipple at the moment. But I still wasn't going to just accept that graph as fact. Just another thing to do more research on. :read:

So I guess it's still up in the air which is going to generate overall more power, the ported Eaton or the Whipple. Maybe I will have to do both to have a final answer to my question. :dw:

 

[Ryushin]

Ryushin your missing one VERY important detail...you live at 6500 ft. The chances of you putting a hurt on your motor up here is pretty slim!

When my car dyno'd 494 SAE it was actually putting 380 to the wheels up here. If you pully an eaton for 19lbs up here you will probably see 13-14, if you pully a Whipple for 13 you will see 9-10. No matter what; when you dyno 500 up here you will actually see less than 400 actual HP and run mid 12's. Like I said the chances of you hurting you motor...not likely. Welcome to running a car a mile high.

Oh yea, I'm very aware of our altitude problem. I dyno'd a couple of weeks ago just to get a base line before I start modifying. I always ask for a copy of the graph that is not corrected for altitude. It showed 364 SAE, and 300 uncorrected.

It would be cool to run 500 horses uncorrected here in Denver. When I was at Cars Performance (Evo Shop) getting the dyno done, they had a 800 HP 4 cylinder Evo there running on 91 octane on the stock block. I didn't see the dyno graph, but if it's true, that's just insane. I guess thats why that Evo had a rod sticking out of the block. He said when it got colder it got some detonation and threw the rod. It had been running fine all summer. Isn't that backwards? Shouldn't the cooler air prevent detonation? Oh well.

Maybe I'll just end up going with a stock whipple at 13 psi and just swap the SC when I need warranty work. Not sure yet. More homework is needed.

 

[jm@ReischePerf]

I think you're confused about what this graph is telling you. There's no way that this Whipple is at 8-10lbs. When they stay stock boost on the Whipple, they mean 13lbs... semantics.

 

[Ryushin]

I think you're confused about what this graph is telling you. There's no way that this Whipple is at 8-10lbs. When they stay stock boost on the Whipple, they mean 13lbs... semantics.

I thought it might be a too good to be true. Though on their web page, it lists the Whipple can run from 8-25 psi. I thought they would have done a apples to apples comparison.

But on the other hand, porting the Eaton with a CAI raises the hp by 48 hp. Though in the graph is shows almost a 100 hp increase for the Whipple without a CAI. So yea, most likely that is with 13psi.

 

[1svtfan]

You are kind of missing the point here. Stock boost for a Whipple is 13# you aren't going to get any real benefit running it much lower than that. Running a Whipple at 13#s is about the ONLY situation where it runs cooler than a ported eaton. As you raise the boost, IATs are the same.

Lowering the boost on the Whipple will soften the low end and give you nominal high RPM gains. My point is you will start to deminish the area under the curve. If you want 500 HP, your best bet is to run a ported eaton. I think you would be unsatisfied running a Whipple at 10#, if it could even be done. A proted eaton car would be faster.

By the way, I have a knock sensor, wideband o2 and EGT gauge in my car. I also monitor IAT and IAT2. You have to do something stupid in the tune to get it to knock under 500 WHP.

What he said. It sounds like you aren't out to break any records but to enjoy the car.

Unless you are at the strip on a regular basis or have LOTS of open space around you for top end runs, you would probably be happy with a ported Eaton. Having had the opportunity to compare stock, ported eaton, 13psi whipple, 17psi whipple I have stayed with the ported Eaton.

Before anyone screams that I'm nuts let me clarify. If you don't have the ability or desire to run it for all its worth, its not worth it. Pretty simple.

Mine comes out of the garage for the occasional track day, and that's pretty much it. I put the money into the chassis. All the supporting mods are on the bench, but I haven't seen the need to upgrade to a whipple yet..........

Just my $.02

 

[2004silvercobra]

:lol: I'm not the one tossing out incorrect information by saying a TS at the same boost level of an Eaton will only produce 10 to 20 HP. LOL... failed attempt. :kaboom: Please try again Colorado.

i really wish u would come out here for two reasons, one to get an ass kickin like your dad used to hand u, and to see how slow your stripped out cobra can run....


why the hell would u spend 3grand on a whipple at 8psi when u can run a ported for less at 12psi and get the same results.. but then again thats two high and 8psi on a ported wont do shit either... so please let me know where my failed attempt was... yes it might run a little cooler or whatever, but i doubt at 8lbs your gonna see a huge gain.. same when a 2.8 or 3.4 at 17/18lbs runs about the same or less as a 2.2/2.3.. just because its bigger doesnt mean its gonna produce crazy numbers at that low of boost...

 

[jm@ReischePerf]

If you don't have the ability or desire to run it for all its worth, its not worth it.

Agreed. Twin screw at low boost = pointless and money wasted.

 

[Almo]

i really wish u would come out here for two reasons, one to get an ass kickin like your dad used to hand u, and to see how slow your stripped out cobra can run....


why the hell would u spend 3grand on a whipple at 8psi when u can run a ported for less at 12psi and get the same results.. but then again thats two high and 8psi on a ported wont do shit either... so please let me know where my failed attempt was... yes it might run a little cooler or whatever, but i doubt at 8lbs your gonna see a huge gain.. same when a 2.8 or 3.4 at 17/18lbs runs about the same or less as a 2.2/2.3.. just because its bigger doesnt mean its gonna produce crazy numbers at that low of boost...

Ass kicking? Like my Daddy used to give me. How f'n old are you... you sound like you're 18.

Not to mention, why don't you bring your happy ass out to the East coast and show how much money you would be spending on a fuel system and retune before you would even think about running a 10 second pass in this area. It is then you can have a seat in the bleachers and I'll show you how to drive your car. :bored:

Otherwise, I don't think you get it!

Again, I wasn't the one that said comparing same boost level with the Whipple to the Eaton would only be 10 to 20 HP. Now you toss up a stupid ass reply trying to ask questions avoiding what you stated in the first place. Another failed attempt... Please try again! :kaboom: