Suggestions on track day cooling/oil

[sn95Cobrakai]

I have decided that I will be doing some cooling mods this winter to keep my engine temps down this upcoming track season. During the track season I am running a mixture of 75% water and 25% antifreeze and a bottle of water wetter. So far the car will be getting a Fluidyne radiator, I will be boxing the radiator, replacing the stock airdam with a larger one, and getting an autometer water temp gauge to keep an eye on it.
That being said is there anything else I should be considering?
what are your guys thoughts on an aluminum fan shroud like this 1997-04 Mustang Aluminum Fan And Shroud Kit at LRS - Free Shipping!? worth it?
Should I also be looking into a different thermostat?
Also I can't find any decent input regarding oil for open track days. I am running auto store Royal Purple 5w30 which is what is always in my car. I know RP has other types ie: HPS and XPS. My other friends mostly just run motorcraft oil. Any specific oil I should look into? and should I be changing the oil after each track event?

 

[MFE]

I spent a LOT of time studying the Product Data Sheets for a variety of oil brands and weights, and learning more about what the data is all about, and I send my oil to Blackstone for analysis every time I change it. IMHO, 5w30 is way too light for hard, hot track day use. But I guess it depends on whose oil it is. To me, one of the more useful data points is "HTHS Viscosity @150C", which is the High Temperature/High Shear test, which measures the ability of the oil to maintain a decent viscosity under the conditions it might find at a crank bearing on a hot race track, and the higher the number, the better. Unfortunately, HTHS is inversely proportional to fuel economy, and if I remember correctly, somebody correct me if i'm wrong, but HTHS vs light viscosity is why BMW mandated a very specific and very expensive engine oil for some of their higher-strung cars: It was the only one that could be low enough viscosity for their fuel economy requirements while still exceeding their HTHS requirements.

Anyway, I run Redline 15w/50, because my engine builder set mine up a little on the "loose" side knowing exactly how I'd be using it. I've run as light as 10w/40 on the track, but I sometimes see oil temps as high as 270F and I prefer the viscosity wiggle-room I get out of the 50-weight oil.

In redline's case, the HTHS of 15w/50 is 5.8 and 10w/40 is 4.7. Their 5w/30's is 3.8.

I'm not trying to sell anyone on Redline in particular, but do your research. For comparison, Mobil 1's 5w/30 HTHS is 3.1 and the religious-nut AMSOIL 5w/30 is 3.2

There's more to oil than HTHS...do some digging, and when in doubt, for track use, go heavier.

And no, I wouldn't bother changing the oil after every track day.

 

[racebronco2]

I have decided that I will be doing some cooling mods this winter to keep my engine temps down this upcoming track season. During the track season I am running a mixture of 75% water and 25% antifreeze and a bottle of water wetter. So far the car will be getting a Fluidyne radiator, I will be boxing the radiator, replacing the stock airdam with a larger one, and getting an autometer water temp gauge to keep an eye on it.
That being said is there anything else I should be considering?
what are your guys thoughts on an aluminum fan shroud like this 1997-04 Mustang Aluminum Fan And Shroud Kit at LRS - Free Shipping!? worth it?
Should I also be looking into a different thermostat?
Also I can't find any decent input regarding oil for open track days. I am running auto store Royal Purple 5w30 which is what is always in my car. I know RP has other types ie: HPS and XPS. My other friends mostly just run motorcraft oil. Any specific oil I should look into? and should I be changing the oil after each track event?

The fan and shroud kit will not run any cooler then what you have on you car while open tracking. The air going thru your radiator is much more than any fan could ever do.

Do a search for cooling mods.

 

[wheelhopper]

I don't see what type of car you have. Here is what I would recomend to start

Intstall a new 3 row aluminum radiator.
Install an oil cooler.

After these mods see how the cars temps are. These 2 mods keep my water temp below 210 in severe conditions and my oil rarely sees above 220.

As far as what oil. I have gotten in the habit of using a 5 qt jug of Motorcraft 15w40 diesel oil with a quart of synthetic lucas oil stabilizer.

I drive a '90 GT on track with the original 98K mile short block.

Here's a vid of me driving it on track. Just so you know I drive it hard enough to heat it up.
VIR 10/2012 '90 Mustang on Vimeo

 

[sn95Cobrakai]

It is a 98 cobra. I am aiming for around 250* for oil temp, though I do not have an oil temp gauge and I hadnt really thought about it. I assumed water temp. and oil pressure would be of more importance for next season. The 3 core radiator is going in no matter what. Idk if I will get around to doing an oil cooler anytime soon. Though I am in the process of piecing together a rear diff. cooler which will be installed when the IRS goes in. it could be repurposed, I guess, if needed.
I wasnt sure if the fan/shroud would be worth the money, I am sure I could alot the 200 somewhere else.
I just wanna make sure this thing runs coool cause road america during the summer can run up the temp quick.
p.s. nice vid wheelhopper

 

[MFE]

If you want to make sure it's cool, then install an oil temperature gauge. There is no other way to know. You can't use your coolant temp as any kind of guide to what your oil temp is, because oil temp can easily run 50 degrees hotter than coolant temp.

 

[sn95Cobrakai]

I am installing a dual gauge pillar this spring. I was going with a H2o temp and oil pressure gauge. Should I sub out the H2o temp for oil temp? :shrug: and from research I have read that somewhere around 250* is optimal for oil temp in a 4.6. I suppose oil viscosity and weight would play a role in that #

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

If you use a high quality high film strength oil, when the oil is as hot as it is likely to ever get, you technically only need between 6 to 8 psi of oil pressure per 1,000 rpm.

Test with very hot oil, this test is not helpfully with cold or normal temp oil.

Most guys will be able to get away with a one viscosity grade bump, which for most will be a 40 weight.

Instructors and advanced group guys are faster and will load more heat into the oil. Also guys running sessions longer than 1/2 hour are going to finding out if they are bumping into the limit of their system's ability to remove heat and if it is up to the task.

If you can get away with a lighter oil for the temps you run at run it do it.
A 30 weight is better able to remove heat from oil cooled components than a 40 weight and the same is true of a 40 weight over a 50 weight.

Overly thick oil and overly high oil pressure does not equal better protection.

The higher the rpm the less desirable a thicker oil becomes. Oil pumps release pressure at a certain point because at high rpm the rotation actually creates a hydrodynamic wedge that makes additional pressure unneeded and counter productive.

Get the oil really hot, then see what your oil psi is.
Then run as light an oil that will keep you within the guide, it will remove more heat.

Don't run a crap oil though, we are talking about race conditions that your engine is seeing.

Royal Purple HPS series oils will provide higher film strength than most of our competitors full race oils, yet they are priced very reasonably and very close to our API/SAE regular warranty compliant street oils.

Though comparable film strength will be very hard to come by, there are a lot of oils that will get the job done and be just fine.

Even with the API oils chemistry restrictions considered, even the mediocre oils made today and in the last 5 years are vastly superior to the crap we had to deal with back in the 60s,70s, 80s and even the 90s.

 

[sn95Cobrakai]

Test with very hot oil, this test is not helpfully with cold or normal temp oil.

Get the oil really hot, then see what your oil psi is.
Then run as light an oil that will keep you within the guide, it will remove more heat.

By "within the guide" do you mean within the 6-8 psi per 1000 rpms?
ie: 4000rpms = 24-32psi of oil pressure
and what would "really hot" dictate in terms of temperature? What oil temp is safe/optimal for that matter?
Thanks guys for all the good infomation BTW

 

[wheelhopper]

Definitely save the money on the fan shroud. Install the radiator, that will make a big difference in temps, along with a water temp., oil temp., and oil pres. gauge kit.

I never intended to get an oil cooler on my car. When I saw the oil temps getting to 260 I figured I better do it. I am glad I did. I recomend you do it. Just put the $200 you were going to spend on the shroud toward it and you will have a big portion of the cost covered.

 

[sn95Cobrakai]

I never intended to get an oil cooler on my car. When I saw the oil temps getting to 260 I figured I better do it. I am glad I did. I recomend you do it. Just put the $200 you were going to spend on the shroud toward it and you will have a big portion of the cost covered.

What oil cooler are you running? anyone with recommendations on that? I never really considered it. Don't 4.6s have a stock oil cooler?:shrug:

 

[N/Angel]

here's my setup that I frequently run on the German Autobahn without speed limit. I have never run into any cooling issues and I run a Terminator setup with around 14psi boost.

Racimex external oil cooler and a modified water cooling setup using the Ford Racing water inlet adapter

during the install, oil hoses not yet hooked up

 

[wheelhopper]

The location looks similiar to mine. Except my engine bay has a little more room. I do not have AC and all my emission stuff is gone. Since my car came with a mechanicla fan, I removed it. I installed a Black Magic electric fan that is shifted over toward the passenger side and my oil cooler connects to the back side of the radiator on the drivers side between the electric fan shroud and the end of the radiator. Some were concerned about the oil cooler getting heat soaked from the radiator, but prior to the oil cooler install I could lay my hand on the surface of the radiator and leave it there. That is the cool side after all.

It has worked perfectly and made for a nice install. I also used braided lines.

 

[sn95Cobrakai]

It is hard to tell from the pictures where everything is going. I am trying to envision how it works. I understand oil comes out of the motor where the oil filter would normally be but how does that even hook up?:??: I was looking at the Racimex site and it doesn't seem like there is enough parts there to hook it all up. Is there some kind of adapter that replaces the oil filter? Do you remove the stock oil cooler setup?
On a side note, When doing an engine oil change with an external oil cooler how do you remove all the oil from the system?

 

[WutApex]

Hmmm. ...I've been running Castrol High Mileage 5w30 because I thought it was a decent "off-the-shelf" oil based off a couple sites I read. I change my oil out every two to three track weekends (minimal street driving) based off of how hard I ran and iif it was really hot out.

Am I doing a disservice to my motor?

How often would I need to change out the oil if I used a higher quality, e.g. RP HPS.

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

Hmmm. ...I've been running Castrol High Mileage 5w30 because I thought it was a decent "off-the-shelf" oil based off a couple sites I read. I change my oil out every two to three track weekends (minimal street driving) based off of how hard I ran and iif it was really hot out.

Am I doing a disservice to my motor?

How often would I need to change out the oil if I used a higher quality, e.g. RP HPS.

Depending on how many track events a year you do, plan on at least tripling what you are doing now and more likely once a year will be sufficient.

Obviously if you are on a race track every weekend you are not going to want to do annual changes.

 

[wheelhopper]

It is hard to tell from the pictures where everything is going. I am trying to envision how it works. I understand oil comes out of the motor where the oil filter would normally be but how does that even hook up?:??: I was looking at the Racimex site and it doesn't seem like there is enough parts there to hook it all up. Is there some kind of adapter that replaces the oil filter? Do you remove the stock oil cooler setup?
On a side note, When doing an engine oil change with an external oil cooler how do you remove all the oil from the system?

I have an adaptor that fits between the existing filter and block. I had to switch to a shorter filter, which was not hard to find for the 302. The adaptor is about 1.5" wide. I then simply routed a supply and return hose to the cooler and it was done. The adaptor also provided 2 ports which I used to install an oil temp and pres. gauge. I found it on Ebay. If you do a search for your car you should find one.

As far as changing the oil. I change it like I always have. I am sure a little oil is left in the supply/return lines, but probably no more than 1/2 quart. I guess you could disconect the lines and drain them. It would be easy enough. The way mine is located it is as easy to get to as the oil filter. Since I change the oil every other track day, I don't worry about it.

 

[TXPD]

i just noticed this thread. you should not be going onto any race track with antifreeze in the car. no. dont do that anymore.

as to the oil ive been a royal purple driver fror 5 years now. roush yates recommends 5w30

 

[mufflerbearing]

I totally agree. Do not run a car on the track with antifreeze in the car. It is so dangerous.

 

[suaveflooder]

I don't see what type of car you have. Here is what I would recomend to start

Intstall a new 3 row aluminum radiator.
Install an oil cooler.

After these mods see how the cars temps are. These 2 mods keep my water temp below 210 in severe conditions and my oil rarely sees above 220.

As far as what oil. I have gotten in the habit of using a 5 qt jug of Motorcraft 15w40 diesel oil with a quart of synthetic lucas oil stabilizer.

I drive a '90 GT on track with the original 98K mile short block.

Here's a vid of me driving it on track. Just so you know I drive it hard enough to heat it up.
VIR 10/2012 '90 Mustang on Vimeo

Any oil cooler you recommend?