Upcoming Raptor R

[13COBRA]

I have yet to ever encounter a dealer who sold far below cost… it just doesn’t exist. They may minimize their profit to move volume over smaller more profitable transactions but no dealer is selling anywhere close to a loss, or at least not if they want to stay in business.

Take a quick look at the ADM’s being added to special models and then show me any dealer offering the inverse… never seen it. Just looked up a Mach 1 with cloth seats, sticker is $55,040 and the dealerships has it listed for $66,235, $11,195 over MSRP… I have yet to see a dealer offer a new Mach 1 for $44,825…

To answer your question I would prefer to not see crazy deals or huge markups, I’d rather pay close to MSRP.

From 2004-2019 the average transaction price on new vehicles nationwide, was less than dealer cost. Dealerships don't make money selling cars, they make their money servicing vehicles.

I agree with your last sentence. I'm down for MSRP on every vehicle across the board.

 

[GTSpartan]

Thieves steal nearly $1M worth of Ford F-150 Raptor pickups from Dearborn Truck Plant​

Thieves steal nearly $1M worth of Ford F-150 Raptor pickups from Dearborn Truck Plant

An estimated $1 million worth of new 2022 Ford F-150 Raptor pickup trucks were stolen from a Dearborn Truck Plant storage lot, a Dearborn city official confirmed to the Free Press.

Ford reported the missing high-performance trucks, which have a base model price of $69,905, on June 10 with multiple calls to police during that weekend, Bilal Baydoun, City of Dearborn spokesman, said late Thursday.

Dearborn police have recovered 13 vehicles over the last week, mostly in Detroit and a couple in Dearborn, he said after speaking with the Dearborn police chief.

"There was evidence of fences being rammed," Baydoun said. "When they (trucks) were recovered, you could see signs of damage and some things were stripped away, tires, that kind of thing. They were in various states of disrepair."

 

[13COBRA]

Something like this I heard.

 

[csc427]

I have yet to ever encounter a dealer who sold far below cost… it just doesn’t exist. They may minimize their profit to move volume over smaller more profitable transactions but no dealer is selling anywhere close to a loss, or at least not if they want to stay in business.

Take a quick look at the ADM’s being added to special models and then show me any dealer offering the inverse… never seen it. Just looked up a Mach 1 with cloth seats, sticker is $55,040 and the dealerships has it listed for $66,235, $11,195 over MSRP… I have yet to see a dealer offer a new Mach 1 for $44,825…

To answer your question I would prefer to not see crazy deals or huge markups, I’d rather pay close to MSRP.

Several dodge/Chrysler/jeep/ram dealers across the country are selling 9-10k off msrp. Has to be new orders, not vehicles on the lot. This is on hellcat/redeyes, Trx, jeep 392, etc. I ordered a 22 lvl 2 TRX in November. Msrp was $96k. I paid $83k. Plus $450 doc fees. That particular dealer has sold almost 200 TRX’s. So these deals for certain exist, just not that common.

 

[*Jay*]

Several dodge/Chrysler/jeep/ram dealers across the country are selling 9-10k off msrp. Has to be new orders, not vehicles on the lot. This is on hellcat/redeyes, Trx, jeep 392, etc. I ordered a 22 lvl 2 TRX in November. Msrp was $96k. I paid $83k. Plus $450 doc fees. That particular dealer has sold almost 200 TRX’s. So these deals for certain exist, just not that common.

I am constantly back and forth on ordering an Ignition TRX because of that deal. Since I am already dragging my feet, when do the order books close for the TRX and open for the R???

 

[01silverstang]

Several dodge/Chrysler/jeep/ram dealers across the country are selling 9-10k off msrp. Has to be new orders, not vehicles on the lot. This is on hellcat/redeyes, Trx, jeep 392, etc. I ordered a 22 lvl 2 TRX in November. Msrp was $96k. I paid $83k. Plus $450 doc fees. That particular dealer has sold almost 200 TRX’s. So these deals for certain exist, just not that common.

Sounds like the dealers you mentioned are playing the volume game, I would still guess that they are not selling at a loss. I checked and local dealers seem to be listing Ram TRX's at MSRP which is nice.

 

[kaz109]

 

[csc427]

Sounds like the dealers you mentioned are playing the volume game, I would still guess that they are not selling at a loss. I checked and local dealers seem to be listing Ram TRX's at MSRP which is nice.

I’m sure it’s not at a loss. Even at $1k in profit, sell 200 of them and you’ve done great.

 

[13COBRA]

I’m sure it’s not at a loss. Even at $1k in profit, sell 200 of them and you’ve done great.

Except, you haven't. It'd still be a loss.

 

[csc427]

Except, you haven't. It'd still be a loss.

I have no idea how any of that works. They move a crap ton of cars and I assume they’re making some money or they couldn’t stay in business. And gave me a smokin deal. Lol

 

[wizbangdoodle]

As much as consumers don't like ADM's, that's capitalism baby. It works.

Your government is lying to you

 

[me32]

I have yet to ever encounter a dealer who sold far below cost… it just doesn’t exist. They may minimize their profit to move volume over smaller more profitable transactions but no dealer is selling anywhere close to a loss, or at least not if they want to stay in business.

Take a quick look at the ADM’s being added to special models and then show me any dealer offering the inverse… never seen it. Just looked up a Mach 1 with cloth seats, sticker is $55,040 and the dealerships has it listed for $66,235, $11,195 over MSRP… I have yet to see a dealer offer a new Mach 1 for $44,825…

To answer your question I would prefer to not see crazy deals or huge markups, I’d rather pay close to MSRP.

You dont get out much. When i bought my 2003 cobra vert brand new its MSRP was around $41k. I bought at $29,999. If you are willing to look deals can be had. If you just want to shop in your back yard. Then sometimes you pay a Convenience fee.

 

[01silverstang]

You dont get out much. When i bought my 2003 cobra vert brand new its MSRP was around $41k. I bought at $29,999. If you are willing to look deals can be had. If you just want to shop in your back yard. Then sometimes you pay a Convenience fee.

Yes 19 years ago it may have been easier to get a special model like the 03' Cobra at a discount. However, over the last 19 years it has become increasingly more common especially with the rise of the internet for dealers to tack on $10k + as an ADM, because that's capitalism baby... still doesn't make it right, and as I stated I would much rather know I could get a car like that at MSRP then have to hunt for deals and avoid ADM.

I won't reply beyond this as this thread isn't about ADM and should on topic for the new Raptor R.

 

[13COBRA]

I have no idea how any of that works. They move a crap ton of cars and I assume they’re making some money or they couldn’t stay in business. And gave me a smokin deal. Lol

The average new car store, after paying variable and fixed expenses. has an ROI of about 0.3%. Meaning, for every $1,000 they gross on a vehicle, $3 finds its way to the bottom line. There are a lot of people (variable) and a lot of overhead (fixed) that is contributed to the new car sales department. Used is about 2.7%, or $27 per $1,000.

 

[CompOrange04GT]

You dont get out much. When i bought my 2003 cobra vert brand new its MSRP was around $41k. I bought at $29,999. If you are willing to look deals can be had. If you just want to shop in your back yard. Then sometimes you pay a Convenience fee.

Are you really comparing 2003 to 2022?

And saying WE don’t get out much? Have you not gotten out in 19 years ?

 

[C0bra99]

The average new car store, after paying variable and fixed expenses. has an ROI of about 0.3%. Meaning, for every $1,000 they gross on a vehicle, $3 finds its way to the bottom line. There are a lot of people (variable) and a lot of overhead (fixed) that is contributed to the new car sales department. Used is about 2.7%, or $27 per $1,000.

You make it seem like dealerships aren’t making any money. I get it that they have to sell cars to service cars. Many industries have loss leaders to sell other products for a higher markup. My concern is it is so obvious with ADMs that they know your ripping them off. I'm more of a balanced approach where you make some money (MSRP, hold-back, incentives and bonuses) the customer isn't taken to the cleaners, they feel good you feel good the vehicle is serviced and you make some dough on the back-end and all is good. But to come out and make it seem like the dealers are struggling and that justifies the high markup is a little rich. You can just say capitalism but when the going gets tough and you want the repeat business that is where you get you ROI with the fair relationship you have with your client base.

As much as consumers don't like ADM's, that's capitalism baby. It works.

Your government is lying to you

Where is the limit? When does it turn from capitalism to just greed?

 

[13COBRA]

You make it seem like dealerships aren’t making any money. I get it that they have to sell cars to service cars. Many industries have loss leaders to sell other products for a higher markup. My concern is it is so obvious with ADMs that they know your ripping them off. I'm more of a balanced approach where you make some money (MSRP, hold-back, incentives and bonuses) the customer isn't taken to the cleaners, they feel good you feel good the vehicle is serviced and you make some dough on the back-end and all is good. But to come out and make it seem like the dealers are struggling and that justifies the high markup is a little rich. You can just say capitalism but when the going gets tough and you want the repeat business that is where you get you ROI with the fair relationship you have with your client base.

Where is the limit? When does it turn from capitalism to just greed?

I never said dealerships aren't making money. I just expressed the net ROI in different departments. With fewer new cars to sell, service ALWAYS picks up, because people have to spend more money maintaining what they have.

I am 100% for selling everything at MSRP. Margins, on average, would increase significantly.

Dealers aren't struggling to sell vehicles, they're struggling to get vehicles to sell. A friend of mine runs a huge Chevrolet store in Vegas. They usually have 1300 in stock, right now they have <80. They're selling at $10-15k over MSRP, because the market there will bare it and they're maximizing each deal. When the market softens, or when inventory grows, prices come down, because that's what the market will bare.

"The limit" is a slippery slope to talk about. In every industry, manufacturers produce products that have a specific value (cost to them), and every consumer has their perceived value of that product. They try to maximize the sales price so that the sales price equals the perceived value of the masses. Do all people have the same perceived value for every product? No. That's why not everyone drives a Mercedes, or has an iPhone. When I grab a tool at Harbor Freight for 15% the cost of a name brand tool, and 'professionals' spend the money on the name brand tool...using a tool a few times, isn't worth 10x's the money to me, while to a professional who uses it daily, it is.

It's truly supply and demand. When prices start increasing over the perceived value of people and supply increases of demand, demand drops lower and forces a price correction. Then it all balances again

 

[wizbangdoodle]

You make it seem like dealerships aren’t making any money. I get it that they have to sell cars to service cars. Many industries have loss leaders to sell other products for a higher markup. My concern is it is so obvious with ADMs that they know your ripping them off. I'm more of a balanced approach where you make some money (MSRP, hold-back, incentives and bonuses) the customer isn't taken to the cleaners, they feel good you feel good the vehicle is serviced and you make some dough on the back-end and all is good. But to come out and make it seem like the dealers are struggling and that justifies the high markup is a little rich. You can just say capitalism but when the going gets tough and you want the repeat business that is where you get you ROI with the fair relationship you have with your client base.

Where is the limit? When does it turn from capitalism to just greed?

I'd say it doesn't. Simple supply and demand. If there are people out there that want the vehicle and are willing to pay that price, it just goes up. My guess is, demand for the bronco is going to level off. Prices should stabilize soon.

Your government is lying to you

 

[13COBRA]

I'd say it doesn't. Simple supply and demand. If there are people out there that want the vehicle and are willing to pay that price, it just goes up. My guess is, demand for the bronco is going to level off. Prices should stabilize soon.

Your government is lying to you

Barring a complete fallout in the economy or a complete change up in stocking, Bronco prices will drop significantly in 2024. That's about the time that retail orders will be filled and stock units will become more readily available.

 

[AustinSN]

You make it seem like dealerships aren’t making any money. I get it that they have to sell cars to service cars. Many industries have loss leaders to sell other products for a higher markup. My concern is it is so obvious with ADMs that they know your ripping them off. I'm more of a balanced approach where you make some money (MSRP, hold-back, incentives and bonuses) the customer isn't taken to the cleaners, they feel good you feel good the vehicle is serviced and you make some dough on the back-end and all is good. But to come out and make it seem like the dealers are struggling and that justifies the high markup is a little rich. You can just say capitalism but when the going gets tough and you want the repeat business that is where you get you ROI with the fair relationship you have with your client base.

Where is the limit? When does it turn from capitalism to just greed?

You'd rather every car cost $500-$8000 more just to keep very special editions (like this truck) from having a mark up?

How often are you only buying special edition vehicles?