any of you guys not getting a 350 anymore now that the zl1 is out?

[Snoopy49]

Semantics, they will bet out at the end of the year as a 2017 model.

Tell yourself that when your standing at the urinal. It's either out or it's not, if it's not, you going to be very embarrassed.

 

[liter of cola]

liquid to liquid cooling is the most effective, its how engine blocks are cooled. The coolant recirculates around the block and is then cooled in the radiator. In this case you will have liquid to liquid heat exchanges cooling other aspects of the drive line. It can be a shared loop or a second stand alone loop with its own radiator

what you just described is liquid to air. pretty much how all water cooling is done as far as I know. so yeah that's the same as the 350.

Tell yourself that when your standing at the urinal. It's either out or it's not, if it's not, you going to be very embarrassed.

listen guy, its technically out by the end of the year. what I really meant by its out is that its been revealed. and if I was about to buy a gt350 with an adm right now and then saw this car that's coming out this year im pretty sure i'd wait for the zl1. its surely an attractive alternative.

 

[liter of cola]

The ZL1 is still going to be over 3900#, so that's a little disappointing. I'm curious what Goodyear has done for GM to get back onto their performance cars.
This car should be pretty impressive. It'll be convincingly faster than a GT350 in a straight line, with great brakes and MSRC but a bit heavier. I wouldn't doubt it'll be faster on-track than a GT350 for a second. It's also pretty cool that GM won't require a "track pack" to get all the coolers...because that LT4 is going to need them. Hopefully they include trans, oil, diff, supplemental radiator. Clearly, they've got duplicate coolers for some fluids, which is great.

But again, Z28 and ZL1 sales have been relatively dismal. I didn't even realize that GM was still making the ZL1 in '14/'15, lol.
S.

I hear it will be around 3850#'s, that's not far off of the gt350, and if ford uses a supercharged 5.2 in the next gt500 it will weigh just about that or a little more.

 

[specracer]

Not a chance. We have several mustangs, and several other fords. would never even ponder a Chevy. Does it make any sense? Who cares, in 25 years of car buying, never bought a Chevy, never will.

Again, rational? Nope, but that what I'm sticking with.

 

[liter of cola]

Not a chance. We have several mustangs, and several other fords. would never even ponder a Chevy. Does it make any sense? Who cares, in 25 years of car buying, never bought a Chevy, never will.

Again, rational? Nope, but that what I'm sticking with.

your missing out... brand loyalty only makes you miss out on a lot of awesome cars.

 

[Voltwings]

Liquid to liquid coolers are like what the Boss and track pack GT have. There's a grid where oil and coolant pass through alternating layers, the idea being to use the coolant to pull heat out of the oil. They really dont work that well, a dedicated air cooled oil cooler is better, they just use the liquid to liquid for packaging.

 

[liter of cola]

interesting

 

[Cobra(ed) Up]

your missing out... brand loyalty only makes you miss out on a lot of awesome cars.

:beer: What he said...

 

[AZBOSS]

your missing out... brand loyalty only makes you miss out on a lot of awesome cars.

Agreed on that. The one that really piques my interest is the 2017 Corvette GS but that is (probably going to be) about (at least?) 10K more than I want to spend.
Camaro doesn't really do anything for me.

 

[krt22]

Liquid to liquid coolers are like what the Boss and track pack GT have. There's a grid where oil and coolant pass through alternating layers, the idea being to use the coolant to pull heat out of the oil. They really dont work that well, a dedicated air cooled oil cooler is better, they just use the liquid to liquid for packaging.

Both designs have their merits, but yes proper sizing is key. Properly sized liquid to liquid setups in general are more efficient since you are using conduction vs convection for the key heat transfer mode, and then relying on the better heat transfer rates when extracting heat from coolant (with water being the best) vs oil

From what I read the new camaro has a dedicated coolant loop/radiator just for the drive-line coolers. Given all the flak they got with the Z06, I would venture to say they made it quite robust

 

[ON D BIT]

wait 6 months and you can pick one up for sticker

Or a 10k rebate.

I had an SS as a rental a couple of years ago and it scared the hell out of me, just couldn't see out of the thing.

First and foremost I like the character of my GT350, I doubt very much the ZL1 is going to match the experience.

Not even a bit interested in a ZL1, but I am glad it exists. Great time to be in to performance cars!

Zl1 will be a ferocious ride. However I drove New Camaro you cannot see out of it at all. The ergonomics are difficult.

I'm still trying to figure out why they did not fix this.

No; especially considering the Z06 can barely sustain two laps before choking out with heat soak.

the zl1 is supposedly track ready... it has all the same coolers as the 350 track pack.

shit man i feel like two face, im lovin them both soo fkn much. shit! i dont know how im gonna make up my mind if chevy prices competitively against the 350. im sure they will since base prices for the 350 are going up next model year cuz of track pack being standard.

damn life was so easy before they announced this car... lol, i was like gt350 for sure.
i have no interest in the challenger, and had no interest in the camaro till now. this will be a hard decision, im gonna need to find a way to test drive both before i can make up my mind.

might just go zl1 and then trade her in for the 2018 gt500 in 2019-2020 when adm's calm down for that thing.

decisions decisions.

How does transmission coolers going to stop the motor from overheating?

The ZL1 is still going to be over 3900#, so that's a little disappointing. I'm curious what Goodyear has done for GM to get back onto their performance cars.
This car should be pretty impressive. It'll be convincingly faster than a GT350 in a straight line, with great brakes and MSRC but a bit heavier. I wouldn't doubt it'll be faster on-track than a GT350 for a second. It's also pretty cool that GM won't require a "track pack" to get all the coolers...because that LT4 is going to need them. Hopefully they include trans, oil, diff, supplemental radiator. Clearly, they've got duplicate coolers for some fluids, which is great.

But again, Z28 and ZL1 sales have been relatively dismal. I didn't even realize that GM was still making the ZL1 in '14/'15, lol.
S.

There is no way in hell this car is going to be lighter then a track pack gt350 or a R. It has a supercharger. I will bet it's just around 3950-4000 pounds. In my opinion it's also ugly. You couldn't give me one.

Truth!!

I hear it will be around 3850#'s, that's not far off of the gt350, and if ford uses a supercharged 5.2 in the next gt500 it will weigh just about that or a little more.

How is it only going to add 150lbs when the z06 added about 250lbs over the z51?

Here's the kicker for me. I owned FOUR SVT models... And the Ford Dealers continue to be A holes about ADM even when I have brought other SVT's from them. To be clear, average consumers don't really buy high performance cars. So what does Brand Loyalty mean. Rick Hendricks Chevy near me NEVER charges ADM's on anything as policy. That seems like a dealer that is trying to earn my dollars. I have also had two corvettes. I think Chevy performance cars are just as good as Ford. 640hp and blower whine... Might be worth buying a Camaro!

Find a new dealer!

 

[SoCalShark]

I have owned a '14 ZL1. When I bought that, I drove the 14 SS 1LE back to back to the ZL1 to pick which one. There is an enormous difference in those cars for Driver's feel. I actually liked the feel of the 1LE better. But at the time I really wanted the kick in the pants feel of the more hp and it was really a car for the (then) GF to drive but me to enjoy occasionally. She a Chevy lover, me a Ford Lover but it was to be a car for her. I now have 13 GT500 after parting ways with the Chevy and the Chevy Lover simultaneously. (Great decision on both counts. :thumbsup Again the GT500 vs a track pack GT ( have driven) or a GT350 which I have also driven. (Looking to buy a 350 soon I think.) are really apples to oranges for Drivers feel. Heavier car with more power vs. nimble and that "toss the car around" feeling. Between the breathing of the N/A motor vs heating issues of forced induction and the nimbleness of that weight differential of the 1LE vs ZL1 or our beloved fords you really need to compare them in that light. Going to the twisties, then go with NA. Going in a straight line, then add boost. I admit, I liked the ZL1 for its roadholding with the independent magnaride and the shifter, but honestly it felt like a bit of a pig to drive especially as I had driven a GT500 while owning the ZL1. And more importantly on top of it all, as cool looking and as light as they may be able to make the new gen Camaros, it felt horribly blind to drive. And when pushed at a limit it really did NOT feel comfortable. You hear all the time in racing: Hit your marks. You gotta be able to see all those marks to hit them. The Mustangs just feel more like a drivers car. To me, that is the biggest thing they would ever need to fix with the bowtie. I think the new ZL1s are pretty cool looking with their new lines (but I do agree with the too busy comment in the front) and yeah that jointly developed tranny is pretty great modern technology. But, I prefer to row gears. But the biggest item is to be able to see...point...and shoot the car where I am putting it. The operative word being SEE. Frankly everytime Chevy thinks they caught Ford, Ford just steps it up one more notch....or more. The ZL1 just now may exceed the 13-14 GT500's a little bit, but it is a 17 model. When the new Gt500 comes, I think it will be 3-4 steps ahead of the sadly outgunned ZL1 again. And if those Dodge Boys can ever figure out how to put their felines on a diet, they will be more formidable as well. Sorry Chevy. I guess when you have to be bailed out by the govt (actually us the taxpayers) then you really are starting steps behind a company like Ford that is more effectively managed. Better company, better products, period.

 

[Snorman]

I hear it will be around 3850#'s, that's not far off of the gt350, and if ford uses a supercharged 5.2 in the next gt500 it will weigh just about that or a little more.

GM has stated the new ZL1 will be 200# lighter than the previous one, and that car in an M6 coupe was just over 4100#. So figure ~3900+. I'm not sure what there is to hear about the car, it was just revealed a couple of days ago and only GM knows the details.

Nobody has any idea what will be in the GT500, but expect it will have FI and probably some of the GT350 bits, so expect it to be 3900-4000# from a GTPP's ~3800#.
S.

 

[GT Premi]

I don't think I'd get a ZL1 in lieu of a GT350R. However, the announcement of the new ZL1 definitely makes me want to put the GT350R search on hold to wait for Ford's response to the ZL1, a la GT500. So in a sense, the new ZL1 will indirectly affect sales of the GT350. If I was in the market for a regular GT350, HELL YEAH I would buy the new ZL1 over it!

 

[DBK]

:rollseyes

 

[ON D BIT]

:rollseyes

You should see the complaints on the 350 in roadside. You'd think its a GM forum!! Haha

 

[southern stang]

Ergonomic wise the zl1 is horrible. I'm 5'7 and can't see shit out of the Windows. Blind spots everywhere just like the 5th gen, except worse.

But I can tell you just the SS with the lt1 and new ats platform is leaps and bounds better than the 5th gen. This is all coming from a diehard ford guy, that would not own a Chevy if my life depended on it. But I am a gm tech. Imagine that lol. I have never driven a car that no lift shifts better than the new SS camaro. They got the manual slush box dialed in much better, and handles 10x better than the 5th gen.

I love the 350R but I seriously would have a hard time turning down a new zl1. It is going to be a bad bitch, and there are no other words to explain it. I highly doubt the 350R will have a whole lot for the zl1. Just going based off of facts.

Can't wait for shootouts and tests from motor trend and the like. More importantly, I can't wait to beat on a pdi

 

[rfugio68]

i'd take the zl1 over the gt350 any day. The new chassis with the lt4 and 10 speed will be awesome, visibility isn't great but you get used to it. Also liked the 10-14 interior better, but overall i think the zl1 is a better package, and will be easier to obtain at msrp.

 

[BlownAway03]

i'd take the zl1 over the gt350 any day. The new chassis with the lt4 and 10 speed will be awesome, visibility isn't great but you get used to it. Also liked the 10-14 interior better, but overall i think the zl1 is a better package, and will be easier to obtain at msrp.

I'm with you man. Overall the ZL1 appears to be a better car than the GT350, and I'm sure it's performance will back that up soon. Some folks seem real drunk on the GT350 koolaid. And I'm so sick of this Camaro visibility crap. Are there a bunch of leprechauns around here or something.

 

[ON D BIT]

I'm with you man. Overall the ZL1 appears to be a better car than the GT350, and I'm sure it's performance will back that up soon. Some folks seem real drunk on the GT350 koolaid. And I'm so sick of this Camaro visibility crap. Are there a bunch of leprechauns around here or something.

It seems the camaro was built for leprechauns though. Small windows for small people.

Overall better meaning, I hope it's faster. Regardless of all the raves from the media, the backed up track times we all understand you feel the 350 failed because...I'm not sure why you feel that way?