For the Guys who run a 4L + blower

[sqidd]

The OEM IC's transfer heat fast enough to VAPORIZE the water in them at 17-18psi. The heat transfer that the IC's provide is clearly not the weak point in the system. To take advantage of the OEM IC's heat transfer ability you need to increase the water flow dramatically. And that level of water flow can't be attained without increasing the line/fitting size significantly. Max water flow through the stock fittings being 9.3gpm with the best pump available (Stewart). The OEM 07-12' Bosch pump flows 5.1gpm and the OEM 13-14' Pierburg pump flows 8.5gpm by comparison. This is nowhere near the 25gpm that you want to see. I'm talking about street cars without ice here.

Going with a bigger/higher airflow/more surface area IC will provide less resistance to the airflow (good), but unless you feed them with a lot more water you won't see any benefit to having more surface area because you can't remove the water fast enough.

 

[Weather Man]

Smart move

A high output supercharged engine will show no mercy even with a momentary lean condition and would bring me to tears scoring an aluminum cylinder. I would be very conservative with a Trinity engine which makes gobs of power right out of the box. An iron sleeved late model 5.4 would be a better candidate for an engine you want to throw the kitchen sink at!

That sucks about the cams that's a huge hit to the wallet. Take care of your GT500 it may be the last one Ford produces.

No GT500, just a lowly 4.6 3V at 735 RWHP now. I am running Malcolm's safety box to save it from any lean condition. Doing the cam swap and degreeing the cams again IS a disagreeable surprise. Pretty sure it will be worth it, but no guarantees when you push the envelope.

 

[blowbye]

Its nice to see that fischer motorsports added some lines to increase water flow from the rear of the heads.

 

[madskills1969]

How many people have run spacers on the top of the intake?

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[sqidd]

Why would you want to do that?

 

[SlowSVT]

Why would you want to do that?

moves the IC away from the floor of the intake opening-up the discharge area around the peripheral of the cooler which is a restriction.

There is talk of aftermarket hi-flow IC's but their rating doesn't take into account this restriction.

 

[biminiLX]

So I was going to ask Kurt/BC thru PM but I was interested in the phenolic spacers between heads/intake and blower/intake. Anyone else interested?
Also, my friend used some nice reflective looking heat barrier to wrap the intake where the cooler sits, helping to block it from the valley heat. Seemed like a good idea also.
-J
.

 

[Bad Company]

Its nice to see that fischer motorsports added some lines to increase water flow from the rear of the heads.

The -4 hoses coming off of each corner of the cylinder heads with the water necks and rear coolant piping aren't there to increase coolant flow to speak of. They are de-gas hoses. The purpose of them is to make sure that any air or steam that is in the engine rises to the highest points of the coolant system of the engine to then exit to the highest point of the complete cooling system which is the reservoir. That is what 4 of the 5 lines are on the reservoir. They will have an un-metered amount of coolant flowing through them at all times, but the volume is so low that it will not effect the thermostats job of controlling engine temperatures. The factory has the 2 de-gas hoses at the front of the coolant outlets on the stock water necks that intersect to become 1 hose to the reservoir. Shawn increased the volume of this by 4 times by doing individual hoses from each corner of the engine with individual lines to the reservoir. Will it increase coolant flow? Yes but very little in the grand scheme of the complete system and how it works


The stock cooling system moves most of the coolant to the front of each cylinder head. The rear exits ports on the cylinder heads to the crossover pipe that then runs to the bypass pipe along the driver's side of the block is there to cool the very most rear portions of the cylinder head where coolant flow will stagnate without it, which will create hot spots with all of the coolant exiting the stock front water necks similar to a earlier designed engine. To do a coolant system modification to move a larger amount of coolant out of the rear of the head I believe you would need to use -16 hose at each corner of the heads to match the volume of flow the system is capable of moving. I'd have to do the math to calculate the surface area between the two systems to verify that though. A lot of guys use -12 hose off of each corner for the turbo manifolds for drag race applications, but they aren't driving the car for hours at a time on a 100*F day with the A/C keeping them cool while also sticking their foot in the throttle for smile inducing fun occasionally. I'd rather have too large of a set of hoses exiting the heads and control water flow with a thermostat than to use the hoses as a flow control by volume.

 

[Bad Company]

So I was going to ask Kurt/BC thru PM but I was interested in the phenolic spacers between heads/intake and blower/intake. Anyone else interested?
Also, my friend used some nice reflective looking heat barrier to wrap the intake where the cooler sits, helping to block it from the valley heat. Seemed like a good idea also.
-J
.

J those are from Fischer Motorsports. I had Tony at BES port match them and O-ring them to seal without gaskets.

If you look at my picture they interlock with the new water necks, which are also O-ringed to seal to the heads. Also if you look you'll see the manifold is now held in place with 8mm studs instead of 6mm bolts. There is also dowel pins at the corners to align this set up, you can see them if you look for them.

Fischer Motorsports would be able to make a complete phenolic spacers that would be able to use a go between the head and stock manifold. I don't know how much he would charge for them. I can also tell you that the first thing he is going to say when you ask him about doing this is that without removing the water passages from the intake manifold that it will be a waste of time and money. He feels that the stock water passages in the manifold adds as much heat or more heat than the conductive nature of an aluminum manifold bolted to a cylinder head does.

He will twist your arm to it all. LOL

Now it would be easy to take a stock gasket and use it as a template to have someone make a set of these to be used with stock gaskets and manifold. There are different grades of Phenolic material, I'm sure once I start looking I'll remember the exact material these are made from.

 

[blowbye]

Ive called fischer and is around $5000 to have your intake modified and get the spacers and new water necks. I did email him and ask if i could just purchace the spacers and and water necks and modify my intake myself, but got no response.
He may of added them as gas bleeds but also DOUBLED the amount of fluid output from the rear by doing so. So win/win

 

[blowbye]

BC are your spacers phenolic or acedal plastic? Phenolic has a layered look. All the pictures ive seen of fischers stuff looks to smooth to be phenolic and looks more like acedal plastic. Mabey i was looking at his prototype pieces?

 

[madskills1969]

Like this with -16 out of all 4 corners

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[Robert M]

Going with a bigger/higher airflow/more surface area IC will provide less resistance to the airflow (good), but unless you feed them with a lot more water you won't see any benefit to having more surface area because you can't remove the water fast enough.

^^^^That is the whole reason behind the KB BIGUN, isn't it? To reduce a flow restriction below the blower, especially once an owner starts to upsize past the oem 2.X size blowers? This would make the bigger blowers "blow through" much more efficient.

I never have seen or read where the BIGUN I/C was going to drop incoming air temps or be a RWHP gain mod, although there may be some gains in those areas.



R

 

[sqidd]

moves the IC away from the floor of the intake opening-up the discharge area around the peripheral of the cooler which is a restriction.

There is talk of aftermarket hi-flow IC's but their rating doesn't take into account this restriction.

Maybe I haven't had enough coffee, but I'm lost. Can you help a guy who has taken some pretty big blows to the head with a bit more detail?

 

[sqidd]

So I was going to ask Kurt/BC thru PM but I was interested in the phenolic spacers between heads/intake and blower/intake. Anyone else interested?
Also, my friend used some nice reflective looking heat barrier to wrap the intake where the cooler sits, helping to block it from the valley heat. Seemed like a good idea also.
-J
.

You don't want a phenolic spacer between the blower and manifold. The manifold acts as a heat sink for the blower and is therefore part of its "cooling system". Maybe in a drag situation it wouldn't be a big deal. But for a street/road course or mile car it's not a great idea.

 

[blowbye]

The spacer would be between the heads and the intake manifold to keep the engine heat from transferring to it. Removing the water passages also removes unwanted heat from heating up your intake manifold alowing the intake manifold to perform better and lower iat2 temps.

 

[sqidd]

^^^^That is the whole reason behind the KB BIGUN, isn't it? To reduce a flow restriction below the blower, especially once an owner starts to upsize past the oem 2.X size blowers? This would make the bigger blowers "blow through" much more efficient.

I never have seen or read where the BIGUN I/C was going to drop incoming air temps or be a RWHP gain mod, although there may be some gains in those areas.
R

Right from KB's site:
http://kennebell.net/products/super...y-cobra-jet-5-0-hi-density-core-intercoolers/

-Improves cooling and lower restriction

-23% larger cooling surface area

-33% more rows for reducing air temps

-54% more cooling passages for improved water cooling

Taking into account that you literally can't feed a OEM IC enough water through the OEM "water manifold" on the front of the intake to take advantage of its heat transfer rate, KB's claims of improved cooling are false. If they offered the parts needed to open up the inlet/outlet to a minimum of 1" you will start to be able to tap into those claims. To fully use the added heat transfer ability of the KC IC you would need 1.25" fittings/lines and a Stewart pump.

 

[sqidd]

The spacer would be between the heads and the intake manifold to keep the engine heat from transferring to it. Removing the water passages also removes unwanted heat from heating up your intake manifold alowing the intake manifold to be a better heatsink for your blower because it would be much cooler then. The spacer does not go between the blower and intake manifold.

I was quoting this post:

"So I was going to ask Kurt/BC thru PM but I was interested in the phenolic spacers between heads/intake and blower/intake. Anyone else interested?"

 

[blowbye]

My bad didnt read the quote. Mabey he is thinking of the spacer on the lower plate of the intake manifold?

 

[sqidd]

Mabey he is thinking of the spacer on the lower plate of the intake manifold?

Maybe????