Ford GT Block

[Ryushin]

It looks like the Ford GT Block is for sale again. From what I understand this should fit in our cars without any problems after setting up the block for a wet sump and drill out a dip stick hole. Are there any other major issues installing the Ford GT block into our cars?

 

[Sonic605hp]

op:

 

[ShelbyGuy]

you mean aside from the fact that the ford gt timing cover doesn't have the accessories in the right place or that there's no intake manifold to face the blower the right direction...

and then, are you going to use the inferior 03/04 cobra/aviator/mach heads, or are you going to use the Ford GT/GT500/00R heads, for which there is no intake manifold readily available?

but you can do anything you want if you spend enough money, time, and talent on it...

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

you mean aside from the fact that the ford gt timing cover doesn't have the accessories in the right place or that there's no intake manifold to face the blower the right direction... (GT 500 should work)

and then, are you going to use the inferior 03/04 cobra/aviator/mach heads, (NO, I wouldn't, since you would than also have to run adapter plates, because the intake ports are not long enough to mate up with the manifold) or are you going to use the Ford GT/GT500/00R heads, (These are pretty much required) for which there is no intake manifold readily available? (I have not checked availability of the Gt500 intake but I can when I get back to work Monday.)
but you can do anything you want if you spend enough money, time, and talent on it...

One other issue Shelby Guy must have forgotten, The starter bolts to the trans axle bellhousing on the Ford GT. You will need an adapter to mount your starter in a front engine application.

Pretty involved huh?:dw:

 

[GodStang]

You are looking at ~$5K for block and heads once its converted to wet sump. Then you have a good bit for internals and I think different K member. Then you have to get the timing chain cover and front pulley brackets, then you have to get the GT500 intercooler, lower intake manifold. Like ShelbyGuy said it can be done with the right amount of money.

 

[Ryushin]

I did not think it would be cheap to do. But there is no replacement for displacement. To have a 5.4L aluminum block engine would be outstanding. I was thinking of going with a twin turbo on this maybe running 10-15 lbs of boost. The extra displacement will help with torque on the lower rpms. One of my goals with this car is to crack well into the 200mph range and run the Silver State Classic in the unlimited category. I have no plans on ever winning the SSC, just want to have fun and to compete. But this is probably 3 years out for me. I have a lot of other work I need to do to the car to get there. As everything takes money.

 

[Jroc]

Would a Lincoln Navigator block be a better choice for a 5.4L Aluminum block in a New Edge Mustang? How strong of an Aluminum block is it? I'm sure it isn't a stout as the FGT block, but I imagen you could find one for relatively cheap.

 

[GodStang]

Isn't the Navi block iron? Ya the Navi block is a better route since you can get the WHOLE engine for the price of the GT block, but the GT500/GT heads flow a bit better than the Navi heads and not sure if the gt500 heads can fit on a navi block.

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

A junk yard Navi 5.4 would give you an extremely strong Iron block and an extremely strong forged steel crank, plus front cover, chains, and tensioners.

Items you probably would not want are heads and cams(although the intake cams are the same as ours).

Items you definitely don't want to use would be, powered metal rods, cast pistons, intake and exhaust manifolds.

GT500/Ford GT heads will fit Navi blocks.

 

[Jroc]

My bad. I could of sworn the Navigators block was Aluminum like the 2000 Cobra R's. Y'all are right though its cast iron. I knew its 5.4 was different than the F150/Expedition 5.4's. I guess its uses the same truck block just with DOHC's, right?

 

[Ryushin]

Well, I only want to build this once. So it would be the absolute strongest aluminum block. I don't want to use iron. Heck, I'll choose the 4.6 aluminator over a 5.4 iron block any day. I know the cost will be more, but it will also be fairly unique in the cobra world as well.

 

[01cobravortech]

you mean aside from the fact that the ford gt timing cover doesn't have the accessories in the right place or that there's no intake manifold to face the blower the right direction...

and then, are you going to use the inferior 03/04 cobra/aviator/mach heads, or are you going to use the Ford GT/GT500/00R heads, for which there is no intake manifold readily available?

but you can do anything you want if you spend enough money, time, and talent on it...

You sure know how to bring people back to reality ShelbyGuy. :lol1:

 

[CobraBob]

Well, Shelby Guy gave you all of the reasons why this would not be a smart way to go, but here's a question I have. What is your goal? You say there is no replacement for displacement. Okay. But you can install a built 4.6 along with a twin turbo setup and make north of 800rwhp. That's not enough? Which is why I'm asking what your goal is. To me it makes no sense to spend a small fortune trying to adapt the Ford GT motor to a Terminator. Not when you can make a very reliable and stout built setup with less dollars.

 

[04MystiCobra]

fyi - Theres a 6.3L stroker for the 5.4s as well.
I wanted to go 5.4 too but to have a really nice setup you'll be approaching $10k just for the motor and thats just a bit much for me. The GT/GT500 heads are $2500+ by themselves.
Theres a guy on MF that has a list of things needed for a simple swap. Doesnt look too bad or expensive. He'll mod your timing cover, and brackets and makes some adapter plates to make it work. All you need is the shortblock since your Cobra heads will work. Karkraft sells 5.4 GT blocks already setup for wet sump.
You can come pretty close to the 330CI with an aluminum 4.6 stroker and save even more weight since you'll still be in a 4.6 block.

 

[GodStang]

fyi - Theres a 6.3L stroker for the 5.4s as well.
I wanted to go 5.4 too but to have a really nice setup you'll be approaching $10k just for the motor and thats just a bit much for me. The GT/GT500 heads are $2500+ by themselves.
Theres a guy on MF that has a list of things needed for a simple swap. Doesnt look too bad or expensive. He'll mod your timing cover, and brackets and makes some adapter plates to make it work. All you need is the shortblock since your Cobra heads will work. Karkraft sells 5.4 GT blocks already setup for wet sump.
You can come pretty close to the 330CI with an aluminum 4.6 stroker and save even more weight since you'll still be in a 4.6 block.

Crazydave is on this site also. His kit is for the Navi heads NOT the GT500 heads and if you go throught this YOU WANT THE GT500 HEADS!! From the start they are tons better heads and after a P&P they are untouchable.

 

[Ryushin]

Well, after doing some more research, there are things I like about the Ford GT block and some things I don't like. I like that there are oil squirters and two injectors per cylinder. What I don't like is that the 5.4 achieves it's increased capacity by stroking. The bores are the same for the 4.6 and the 5.4. I think I'd rather have a freer revving engine that the 4.6 gives. I'm sure the Aluminator is lighter than the Ford GT block, but by how much I haven't been able to discover.

The thing is, I daily drive my cobra, so I would like to keep some low end torque that the supercharger gives me. Twin Turbo's seem to really only kick in after 2500 rpm. The 5.4 would give me the torque down low until the turbo's spool. After doing a lot of reading I don't think a compound boost is the best of both worlds. I think either twin-screw or turbo, depending on where I want my power band.

I figure I'll need about 800-850 crank HP to get to 215-225 mph. Even though I'm driving an aerodynamic brick. I still think turbo's are the best way to get me there. Maybe I can have the best of both worlds. Go with smaller turbos that will spool better for daily driving and around 550-600 rwhp, and larger turbo's when I want to go to the salt flats.

Maybe the Aluminator is the better choice for my application. Is there anyway to add oil squirters to the 4.6. Doesn't DSS make some kind of bracket that will keep the Aluminator's mains from wandering about when I make more than 700 HP?

The aluminum block should be easier to cool than an iron block. Turbo's won't put so much stress on the engine as a SC would to achieve the same boost/hp level. I figure I have about 12-15K to dump into a engine and another 8-12K to fix my fuel/cooling/aerodynamic/suspension issues.

I'd like to to run on the salt flats without any artificial cooling such as using ice. If I can build an engine that can stay cool enough for that, the unlimited class of SSC should be within reach.

 

[Jroc]

What I don't like is that the 5.4 achieves it's increased capacity by stroking. The bores are the same for the 4.6 and the 5.4.

All Modulars built for production vehicles up to this point(4.6, 5.4, 6.8) share the same 3.552" bore which is its biggest problem. I know that the new FR Boss 302 Modular block(which is a very strong cast iron block) http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=9778 has a 3.700" bore as does the FR Cammer crate motor.

 

[427Windsorman]

Aluminator FTW!

 

[Unoid]

why not 4.6 block bored to 302 and stroked?

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

The thing is, I daily drive my cobra,
I figure I'll need about 800-850 crank HP to get to 215-225 mph.
Is there anyway to add oil squirters to the 4.6. I think the only way would be to machine an orifice into the big end of the rods, but then you have an oil supply issue created which is solved on the Ford GT by the dry sump.
Doesn't DSS make some kind of bracket that will keep the Aluminator's mains from wandering about when I make more than 700 HP? I don't think that will be a big problem since these blocks are incredibly stout!
Also because of this--> Turbo's won't put so much stress on the engine as a SC would to achieve the same boost/hp level.

I figure I have about 12-15K to dump into a engine and another 8-12K to fix my fuel/cooling/aerodynamic/suspension issues.

I'd like to to run on the salt flats without any artificial cooling such as using ice. If I can build an engine that can stay cool enough for that, the unlimited class of SSC should be within reach.

Just a thought here, but the cage required for that class is not going to be fun climbing in and out of as a daily driver.
The safety equipment(including approved wheels and tires) is going to going to add to your prep expense also.