How to go about getting started in OT racing?

[laruei]

Great info!

Thanks guys.. lots of buying planning and a little work ahead.

Cheers all!

 

[laruei]

I run Carbotech pads. http://www.ctbrakes.com/faqs.html
Carbotech likes you to run a new rotor with their pads. For your use I would go AX6 front/ Bobcats in the rear, and you can drive on the street with these and get some heat cycles in those new rotors and pads.

Sir, not to step on your toes or call you out. But i was reading over carbotechs FAQ's and ran across this:

Carbotech™ Bobcat 1521™: "...Bobcat 1521™ is NOT recommended for any track use. "

Carbotech™ AX6™ (1106™): "...Cars in excess of 300hp and/or 3,000lbs should not use AX6™ for any track use.

Now we all know how fat the Termi's are.. and that they are over 390 from the factory.. So i guess my question is..taking there own reccomendation to heart are these not strong enough? I mean if im going to buy a set of pads and rotors for the track im going to get some that are completely dependable and useable for the track... I went to your site specifically (Jimmysidecarr) and it looks like you have the same calipers as me (just a different color) are you experiencing no fade? Have you tried the next higher pad?

Should i do some searching? Is there a post already about this somewhere? I tried searching the net for the "best 2000 cobra r pads" and came up with nothing basically. Just want to make sure im spending the money on the right stuff..

On to my questions:

1. a)I have a 2.8 pulley and idler sitting at home waiting to be installed. I have the amazon unlimited tunning option and all i have to do is install the pulley and call Rick and have him shoot me a tune. Is this not reccomended for when i go to the track? I know it doesnt need more power but i always want more and if the parts are sitting in front of me :nonono:.

1. b)If it will overheat the car at the track should i invest in a AFCO (since i heard they were the BEST).

1. c)Would that alleviate the problem?

1. d)Should i just not install it?

2. Does anyone have a 2.8 pulley isntalled that runs on the track with no cooling mods? If so are you overheating?

3. a) How important is the head cooling mod.. any of them? People talking about me not having one is making me nervous.. i really dont need to buy a new motor.. im not rich I want to do it at some point cause ive heard its important to do im just trying to prioritize..

3. b)If i do need one.. WHICH one? the one that goes in the upper radiator hose? the one that taps under the supercharger or the one that taps into the freeze plugs?

3. c)Dont all of those just do one head.. dont both heads need the mod done?

4. When i take out my rear (towards the firewall) plug on either side they have brown all over the threads.. kinda like rust/dust, if i were to call it anything.. almost like someone istalled them with sand...see enclosed pic. is this an indication i need the cooling mod?

5. I went to the dyno yesterday and with my mail order tune (2nd revision) i gained like 5hp (417 hp 386ftlbs).. im not as much worried about the minimal gain as the A/F's they were ~11.6 or 11.7... is this acceptable for tracking? If not should i ask for a richer tune?

6. Can anyone reccomend a good cheap roll bar camera mount? I know MM sells one for like 100 bucks but thats 100 bucks i could spend on a video camera..i have the 1 3/4" roll bar from autopower.. just like this one except mine has a removable cross brace.. http://www.autopowerindustries.com/Images/lg/DSC_2848.jpg

7. Im going to PM anthony right now about his brake cooling kit but i have reservations about the hose...i dont think its high temp.. i know you can patch it with the tape he reccomended but would high temp hose alleviate that issue... i would assume he used that hose for cost effectiveness but if im going to install this all i want to do it once and right if possible.. so should i upgarde to high temp?

8. Is there a way anyone can tell me if i need to buy the NASA card now just to go an watch for my first time.. or if i can get in without it? Im going to do a few things to the car but i will in no way have the money to do everything i want to do AND have the 225 or however much it is to use the track...i live in SD and with gas the way it is a trip to willow in just gas will be expensive in the cobra..not to mention i would be filling up at least once more if i were actually racing..and on the 21st (http://www.opentrackracing.com/) is there a convoy to drive out?

So many questions.. i just want to go out there.. have fun and be safe..but i dont want to suck becuase of the car, i know ill prob suck as a driver though but thats why im going...also i want the car to have 0 problems if possible when i do get out there.

Thanks a million guys.

 

[laruei]

Ok... ive just decided!

Im going to go to Willow on the 21st and race.. i will use the little money i have saved up for upgrades, on a track day and gas.. apparently that link for open track racing after reading, with the entry fee you can get an instructor for 30 min to help with the basics...basically i wanna get out there and see how hooked im gonna get and go from there..one of the deciding factors was this: http://www.opentrackracing.com/galleries/march12-08/pages/IMG_4312.htm

if that guy can drive a KIA around the track im pretty confident my car even in the shape its in (which i dont think is that bad but apparently not completely track capable) should be fine

SO if anyone can answer those questions above that would be GREATLY appreciated.. but if not then these ones?

What if anything is an absolute necessity for going out the first time.

Im pretty confident as sh!tty as drilled rotors are they will be fine for one track day right?

My brake fluid isnt black so that should be fine?

Coolant is a nice Golden color...

Clutch works perfect along with the shifter...

The rear end is the only thing on the car i worry at all about.. above 130 it shakes.. i dont know how fast the straight out of 9 is but i dont want it locking up and sending me into a wall.. if im in the begginers class i dont have to do 130 down the straights even if i can right?

Tires should be fine...

Maybe run some colder plugs to compensate for the slightly lean tune..

Ideas are deffinitely entertained now! I have one week to get er ready

Thanks again..

 

[laruei]

As an update i got an email back from Mike at Carbontech... Here is what he had to say:

"...on to more important things. I won't sell you AX6 for that car for the track. It will overheat and fade on you. It would be great for 2-3 laps and then it would be bad. The XP8 or XP10 in the front and the AX6 or XP8 in the rear. I have a listing for the 2000 Cobra, but not the R package. That is probably the Brembo that is on the Viper/CTS-V/Lotus packages. If it is, it is the CT592. That costs $184 in XP10 ans $173 in XP8 for the front. The stock 2003 Cobra rear is the CT627A and it costs $140 in XP8 and in AX6 is $125.
UPS ground to you would be somewhere in the $15 range.
The AX6 and the Bobcat (1521) were designed with low temp performance in mind. They are tremendously stronger than OEM or other street pads that are out there, but not at the track. A street/track pad does not exist. You would want to swap out the front set for the track.
Let me know what you think"

Super nice guy.. i guess i would have to go with his reccomendations...hope this helps you out too sir: Jimmysidecarr ? :shrug:

 

[brkntrxn]

I will take a stab at answering a couple of your questions, some of the others can fill in the gaps. Answers in yellow.

Sir, not to step on your toes or call you out. But i was reading over carbotechs FAQ's and ran across this:

Carbotech pads.... taking there own reccomendation to heart are these not strong enough? I would go with XP10s up front and XP8s out back, or XP8s all around. I think what Jimmy was getting at is at the beginning level, you don't have to go all out. I have had buddies run AX6s and Bobcats on 350Zs at the track with no problems (of course, they are lighter and lower power, but he is a pretty fast driver). He also has a "relationship" with Carbotech to test some of their pads. However, with brakes you should err on the cautious side of the equation.

On to my questions:

1. a)I have a 2.8 pulley and idler sitting at home waiting to be installed. I have the amazon unlimited tunning option and all i have to do is install the pulley and call Rick and have him shoot me a tune. Is this not reccomended for when i go to the track? I know it doesnt need more power but i always want more and if the parts are sitting in front of me :nonono:. For a while, stay at low powered and as rich of a tune as possible. Your car will thank you and your wallet will thank you. Lower power will make the car easier to handle and more reliable. You don't need the power right now no matter what you think. I recently pulled the blower off my car so I can go back NA.

1. b)If it will overheat the car at the track should i invest in a AFCO (since i heard they were the BEST). If it overheats, start searching on here for all of the typical cooling mods: hood, boxed radiator, head mod, etc


3. a) How important is the head cooling mod.. any of them? People talking about me not having one is making me nervous.. i really dont need to buy a new motor.. im not rich I want to do it at some point cause ive heard its important to do im just trying to prioritize.. You can do this now or later, your choice. I have the LDC Cooling mod on my 99, but it is no longer made. The driver's side head is the only side that needs it as the passenger side head already had an outlet on the rear that goes to the heater core. This issue is hot coolant pooling at the rear of the driver head (#7 and #8) and pistons overheating.

5. I went to the dyno yesterday and with my mail order tune (2nd revision) i gained like 5hp (417 hp 386ftlbs).. im not as much worried about the minimal gain as the A/F's they were ~11.6 or 11.7... is this acceptable for tracking? If not should i ask for a richer tune? It is probably fine for a first timer to the track, but the richer the better (to a point). Some of the others with Terminators can make a suggested range.

7. Im going to PM anthony right now about his brake cooling kit but i have reservations about the hose...i dont think its high temp.. i know you can patch it with the tape he reccomended but would high temp hose alleviate that issue... i would assume he used that hose for cost effectiveness but if im going to install this all i want to do it once and right if possible.. so should i upgarde to high temp? Your choice, easy enough to wrap with tape if a hole appears

Ok... ive just decided!

Im going to go to Willow on the 21st and race.. i will use the little money i have saved up for upgrades, on a track day and gas.. apparently that link for open track racing after reading, with the entry fee you can get an instructor for 30 min to help with the basics...basically i wanna get out there and see how hooked im gonna get and go from there..one of the deciding factors was this: http://www.opentrackracing.com/galleries/march12-08/pages/IMG_4312.htm Make sure you get an instructor and have them in the car as much as possible. You will not learn everything in 30 minutes -- it takes YEARS!

What if anything is an absolute necessity for going out the first time.

Im pretty confident as sh!tty as drilled rotors are they will be fine for one track day right? Probably, just keep a check on them. However, newbies at the track can be harder on brakes than veterans as you may tend to brake early and long. If you don't change them, keep a very close eye on them. I would change them if it were me.

My brake fluid isnt black so that should be fine? Flush it no matter what. Fluid should be fresh (ie less than 30 days old)

The rear end is the only thing on the car i worry at all about.. above 130 it shakes.. i dont know how fast the straight out of 9 is but i dont want it locking up and sending me into a wall.. if im in the begginers class i dont have to do 130 down the straights even if i can right? You don't ever have to go faster than you desire, no matter the skill level. Don't ever let anyone push you, you can simply stick your hand out the window and give them a point by. The straights are a good place to take it easy, breathe, relax and check your gauges. Unless I am running with someone and having fun, I quite often on the straights only run the car up to the entry speed of the next turn (as long as there is no one behind me). IE, if my maximum turn in speed at the next turn is 60mph, I just run it up to 65 or 70 on a short straight and take a breather. After a while you will get over the need for straight line speed and you will look forward to the turns.

 

[laruei]

Sweet!

Ok, you reccomendation was to leave the power.. not a problem i dont want to mess with a tune this close to a track day..

Brake fluid no problem if im flushing just to get it fresh would a Heavy Duty non-synthetic Dot 3 work or a Dot 4? Im trying to get there as cheap and safe as possible..

As far as the rotors, if i did opt to purchase rotors wouldnt i need new pads too? Not sure on that one..

I like that i dont have to blast down the straight.. thats good to hear.

I agree 30 minutes wouldnt be enough but i completely understand as there are other people that need some help too. I think it would be a good "primer."

Thank you very much for the reply

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

Sir, not to step on your toes or call you out. But i was reading over carbotechs FAQ's and ran across this:

Carbotech™ Bobcat 1521™: "...Bobcat 1521™ is NOT recommended for any track use. "

Carbotech™ AX6™ (1106™): "...Cars in excess of 300hp and/or 3,000lbs should not use AX6™ for any track use.

Now we all know how fat the Termi's are.. and that they are over 390 from the factory.. So i guess my question is..taking there own reccomendation to heart are these not strong enough? I mean if im going to buy a set of pads and rotors for the track im going to get some that are completely dependable and useable for the track... I went to your site specifically (Jimmysidecarr) and it looks like you have the same calipers as me (just a different color) are you experiencing no fade? Have you tried the next higher pad?

Should i do some searching? Is there a post already about this somewhere? I tried searching the net for the "best 2000 cobra r pads" and came up with nothing basically. Just want to make sure im spending the money on the right stuff..

I run XP8s on the back and leave them on for the street.(they squeal a little)
I run XP12s or XP10s up front.
The fronts I do not leave on for the street, I run the Galphers up front on the street.

I don't know how fast you are going to be so I didn't want to plug you into a pad that is a high temp race pad. Street driving is what most cars see the most, so the pads chosen should be a good street pad first, and a good track pad second.

UNLESS You run track only pads up front like I do.

You could run XP8s on all four corners and leave them on, but they will be a little noisey on the street. There are plenty of guys doing this.:beer:

 

[laruei]

I see now.. sorry for the confusion.. i would deffinitely like to get a track set for when i really get into it.. I will take everyones advise and get the XP10's up front and the XP8's for the rear.

Thanks!

 

[gcassidy]

For a camera mount, since you have a rollbar, you can do something like what I did. Get a Bogen mount online for around $30~40, and bolt it to a piece of angle aluminum, then strap that on. It's not as pretty, but it works.

I got a tether from IO Port.

 

[brkntrxn]

DOT 4 synthetic fluid is my recommendation. There is lots of good stuff out there and the opinions on what to use will be numerous. For the first event or two, you can simply pick up some DOT 4 synthetic at your local auto parts place. However, you should consider stepping up to something better than over the shelf stuff.

There was a good thread a while back with a lot of recommendations. Search for brake fluid and it should pop up.

 

[Jimmysidecarr]

I bought one of these for my camera, very adjustable and shake resistant.
http://www.ioportracing.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=CM&Category_Code=IOPP

Problem is the video camera I was given last year is a hard drive camera. It shuts off when things get bumpy and shakey.

Now I need to get something like a memory card or memory stick camera.

BTW: One of the reasons I recommended the lighter duty pads is because they are still better than stock pads and a $#!T load of people, myself included, have run multiple events on stock pads with out problems when we were new.

I did have cooling ducts from day one though, and I think all Mustang drivers should as well.
Even high temp hose gets ripped and needs repair. I wouldn't sweat the cheaper hose, run it and then replace it if needed.

First few events I didn't even dial in more negative camber.

I just did new brake fluid and cooling ducts and away I went!
Needless to say I had a total blast!

I did put it into limp though,(over heated) on a totally stock Terminator! No cat back, no cold air kit, no smaller pulley, STOCK STOCK STOCK!

So watch your temps on the cluster test mode read out, and milk a straight or two if it starts getting up near 109/110C.

If it doesn't respond quick enough turn on your heater.

So you don't bake yourself or crash, set up your dash vent registers ahead of time, in the pits.
Close the one to the left of the wheel and aim the remainder out the passenger window. Then set the heater function to dash vents and the temp to full hot. Do not turn the fan on until you are ready for the extra cooling.

By doing this this way you will only have to flip the fan knob to full, to start the back up cooling system..LOL!

BTW: I still run my heater everytime I'm out running laps.:beer:

 

[David Hester]

Let's talk about camera mounts.
SCCA won't let us use hose clamps for anything but hoses. Apparently some have failed. I had to switch to muffler clamps for even my side window net.
GCR 9.3.52 Window Nets
I have a buddy that builds these. I had (have in the bottom of the tool box) the I/O Port mount. had problem with shaking. All the adjustments were nice, but each section is a lever....Physics thing. It's gonna shake.
Vesa's doesn't vibrate. http://www.svtek.com/products.htm
Another thing REGARDLESS on which you use, Tie them away from your head with a safety strap.
GCR9.3.1 must be secured 2 ways. 1)mount 2)strap
I used one of my old arm restraints from formula car days.
Fasten one end around the camera and the other end to the OTHER side of the car from your head, just in case mount does come loose.

Oh, for pads check out http://www.raceshopper.com/ferodo_compounds.shtml
I know several racers that use the CarboTech stuff, but I really like Hawk.
Edwin is great to work with, gets orders out quickly, and has really good prices.
I got some pads from him this week.

 

[laruei]

So watch your temps on the cluster test mode read out, and milk a straight or two if it starts getting up near 109/110C.

If it doesn't respond quick enough turn on your heater.

So you don't bake yourself or crash, set up your dash vent registers ahead of time, in the pits.
Close the one to the left of the wheel and aim the remainder out the passenger window. Then set the heater function to dash vents and the temp to full hot. Do not turn the fan on until you are ready for the extra cooling.

By doing this this way you will only have to flip the fan knob to full, to start the back up cooling system..LOL!

BTW: I still run my heater everytime I'm out running laps.:beer:

LOL i was just reading this post! awesome..
http://www.svtperformance.com/forums/showthread.php?t=477697&highlight=test+mode :banana:

Sorry to make you say it twice..

 

[laruei]

Looks like this weekend i might be making a camera mount and flushing the brake fluid with the local parts store "high performance" Valvoline SynPower Dot 4.. Yippeeee..

I would like to order that ATE but that stuff is not exactly cheap.. i dont know how you can flush after every race and still afford to race.. lol

Oh and i just emailed about my brake cooling ducts... im on my way!

 

[gcassidy]

I looked at both of those mounts before building mine, they're both nice, it was just a matter of cost. I can see the extra safety in a better mount if I was racing, but I trust my tether. Gawd, if I could only use hose clamps on hoses, my car would fall apart! LOL

Jimmy, think you might need to use your auxiliary cooling more often because you.....oh say.....live in TEXAS?! Good idea on the vent and heater prep, though. I'll remember that. I've gone into limp here once as well.

 

[David Hester]

:lol1:
Duct tape and hose clamps.
You can fix ANYTHING!
Opps Didn't see the tether.
REAL important. Even if a loose camera didn't hit you in the head, You don't want it beating you about the shoulders or chest, either.
Speaking of temps.
Just got back from Nashville Speedway. 250 water, 240 oil. 96 degrees ambient this afternoon. Jeepers it was hot!

 

[gcassidy]

Tether isn't in photo, you didn't miss anything.

It was BE-you-tiful at Summit Point on Sunday. Why can't all track days be like that? :shrug:

 

[laruei]

Im have the HARDEST time getting my camera mount to stop shaking....i have made 3 different mounts with 3 different cameras and all are sucking..

Has anyone found that using a lateral bar instead of the harness or cross bar helps with shake?

I have to go buy a new swivel mount as i broke mine last night...

Ill post pics if anyone is interested in the designs....

 

[ac427cobra]

Im have the HARDEST time getting my camera mount to stop shaking....i have made 3 different mounts with 3 different cameras and all are sucking..

Has anyone found that using a lateral bar instead of the harness or cross bar helps with shake?

I have to go buy a new swivel mount as i broke mine last night...

Ill post pics if anyone is interested in the designs....

Many times it's the camera and not necessarily the mount. Image stabilization is critical for in car use.

I've had the best luck with Sony. I've had terrible luck with Panasonic.

FWIW

:thumbsup::coolman::beer:

 

[laruei]

HAHA funny, cause i have a panasonic DVD which i was told would be terriable, so i went and bought a panasonic minidv with OIS (optical image stabalization) cause the chick at best buy reccomended it, i also have a olympus digital camera...

The DVD takes great video, and doesnt shake.. BUT after some good vibrations (haha) it will look like its still recording and it will just shut off.. i went for a 20 minute drive to test it out on the newest mount and the whole time it showed recording when it wasnt doing anything.. the 2 monutes it did record were perfect though.. very upsetting.

The minidv i assumed would be better since its a little more solid state.. well it would record the whole time it just made you wanna throw up when watching it..

And the digital camera was the same way not to mention the shutter button would click and vibrate while driving which was audible in the mic.

First mount idea.. couldnt get it tight enough for my liking around the bar...

The current idea..which didnt work as of last night.. im going to be removing the middle section of space and bolting it directly to the flat...also i will try it on the diagonal bar as it i have heard it just works better?