Icey Reservoir Anyone?

[Steve@TF]

The IR has an evap core in a tank which replaces the intercooler reservoir in the engine bay. The fluid sloshes through and around the core as it's pumped into and out of the tank. While this produces very good results, the IC system is less efficient for cooling than the sealed KC system.

The KC doesn't replace your intercooler reservoir. It has a sealed unit that sits behind the front bumper where fluid doesn't just slosh around a cold evap core. The fluid is forced through a system of evap core plates, where none of it can slosh passed the sides of the core.
Stewart

its not possible for any of the fluid to bypass the core in our system. the core meets the box's side walls on ALL four sides. the boxes are designed around the shape of the core, so that all four sides sit flush. the fluid is forced to go through the core in our system. in the remote unit, it is pushed directly into the center of the core.

and people ive discussed the system with, engineers, disagree with the idea that it will cause any long term damage to the system before the stock system. and certainly not before the stock a/c system were to go out on its own.

 

[Brahmus]

So how does this work out for folks running the KC where the average daily mean temperature is above 85F? Sounds like to me the AC won't be working so well in the truck if all the refrigerant has already gone through an expansion valve in the KC. Comments?

I think in cab cooling is first, then the KC.

 

[Stewart_H]

So how does this work out for folks running the KC where the average daily mean temperature is above 85F? Sounds like to me the AC won't be working so well in the truck if all the refrigerant has already gone through an expansion valve in the KC. Comments?

The following information is courtesy of Danoid:

The average temps everyone is seeing 50-52 degree air coming from the vents and 52-55 degree coolant temps in the resevoir. What you have to remember is that the resv temps is the hottest temp the coolant is getting. That is right after the innercooler. Going into the innercooler it will see an average of 10 degrees colder.

If you choose to insulate the coolant lines and the resv you can an even better max cold temp. Not only that you will have a longer reserve of cold water.

I am in the process of purchasing my KC, so my info is not based on first-hand knowledge. All the info I obtained about the KC and the IC, in order to make my decision on which to purchase, is directly from the vendor themselves, or information posted by a rep for the vendor (ie Danoid).

I have nothing to do with either company. I'm just a customer trying to do his due diligence and homework before spending money on a mod for my truck.

Stewart

 

[Stewart_H]

its not possible for any of the fluid to bypass the core in our system. the core meets the box's side walls on ALL four sides. the boxes are designed around the shape of the core, so that all four sides sit flush. the fluid is forced to go through the core in our system. in the remote unit, it is pushed directly into the center of the core.

Thanks for clearing that up, Steve. In my PM's with you, that wasn't clear to me.

and people ive discussed the system with, engineers, disagree with the idea that it will cause any long term damage to the system before the stock system. and certainly not before the stock a/c system were to go out on its own.

Well, I am FAR from any kind of a/c guru or expert, but when I contacted the local a/c shop near me, I was advised that its definitely better to have all of the refrigerant pass through the receiver/dryer to filter the impurities, rather than allow some to bypass the receiver/dryer.

Of course there was no hard data for long term affects for having some refigerant bypassing the receiver/dryer, but it does seem logical that somewhere down the line, the system can suffer for it.

I'm not saying your system WILL damage anything Steve, I'm just posting why I chose the KC over the IC, since you asked for discussions on the two different systems.

Stewart

 

[Stewart_H]

Jeff, thanks for correcting!

Stewart

 

[Stewart_H]

I think in cab cooling is first, then the KC.

When I asked Mr. Kincaid about his product, he told me the KC gets the first hit, then in-cab cooling.

Stewart

 

[kirks5oh]

are these going to go into production for us terminator guys??? if so, i would like to see some hard data on this system. i've been waiting for a while for this, it seems to have stalled out

 

[Stewart_H]

The KC also comes with a gauge for monitoring the IC fluid temps, which is pretty cool, and would become invaluable in the event there is a compressor failure or any other a/c related problems.

Stewart

 

[pitstain]

Steve, I ended up choosing the Killer Chiller over the Icey Res for two reasons.

The first reason is the pathway the refrigerant takes in each unit.

For the Icey Res, according to the information you provided to me, the system runs parallel to the OEM A/C system. Some of the freon/refrigerant is t'd off into the Icey Res, cooling the evap core in the reservoir tank, which cools the intercooler fluid. The refrigerant is then directed back to the return line coming off of the accumulator (receiver/dryer), heading back to the compressor.

That pathway means some of the refrigerant (the amount flowing out of the Icey Res) will always bypass the accumulator. The accumulator filters particles and water from the refrigerant. Over time, the particles and water will eventually damage the A/C system because there is always some refrigerant that doesn't get filtered.

The Killer Chiller is different in that the KC system runs in series to the OEM A/C system. ALL of the freon/refrigerant is sent to the KC first, then on to the vehicles A/C evap core, then to the accumulator (receiver/dryer) where it gets filtered, on to the compressor, then back to the Killer Chiller. So all of the refrigerant is always being filtered. Plus, the KC gets the first hit of refrigerant cooling properties, not the vehicle.

The second reason I chose the KC over the IR is the difference in the "heart" of each system.

The IR has an evap core in a tank which replaces the intercooler reservoir in the engine bay. The fluid sloshes through and around the core as it's pumped into and out of the tank. While this produces very good results, the IC system is less efficient for cooling than the sealed KC system.

The KC doesn't replace your intercooler reservoir. It has a sealed unit that sits behind the front bumper where fluid doesn't just slosh around a cold evap core. The fluid is forced through a system of evap core plates, where none of it can slosh passed the sides of the core.

The KC appears to be a more efficient design, in both the refrigerant pathway, and fluid pathway, and in the long run, won't degrade the vehicle a/c system with contaminated refrigerant.

Stewart

Sounds about right.

So how does this work out for folks running the KC where the average daily mean temperature is above 85F? Sounds like to me the AC won't be working so well in the truck if all the refrigerant has already gone through an expansion valve in the KC. Comments?

I had 40-50* A/C vent temps in cab and and 45-65* temps in the fluid tank in 90+* weather

I think in cab cooling is first, then the KC.

When I asked Mr. Kincaid about his product, he told me the KC gets the first hit, then in-cab cooling.

Stewart

Correct, KC first, then in cab evap.



I would like to add info to the rumors of when the A/C compressor shuts off, unless it is purposfully disabled at a certain TPS voltage in the tune, then it will shut off when the lowside pressure switch tells it to, once the suction side of the a/c system drops to a certain PSI the switch opens and the clutch to the a/c compressor is disengaged, once the psi on the suction side rises up to the threashold it will kick the compressor clutch back on, I have an LED on my gauge pillar that lights up when the a/c clutch is energized and have watched this in action on the racetrack, the A/C stayed on at WOT up until the point that the pressure switch kicked it off, there is NO HARM in spinning an A/C compressor too fast, the only harm is spinning it at very low suction side pressures because with refridgerant comes the lubricating PAG oil that keeps the compressor alive, hence why it will only turn off when there is very low suction pressure.

If I can clarify this any further please just ask, this A/C compressor info is relavant to the KC or the IR in daily operation.

 

[Steve@TF]

no problem stewart, i appreciate your input as well :beer:

i just got off the phone with my buddy, a senior engineer, who does all my a/c work. per him:

the dryer has two jobs:

1. it removes moisture (water)

2. it serves as accumulator chamber to protect the compressor.

it doesnt filter out impurities unless youre talking about water. but in the new R134a systems they are no longer putting desident in the systems. many dont even have actual "dryers" any more. its possible that in these trucks, it only acts as an accumulator and not a dryer.

the a/c system is cylical. either way, either system, the refrigerant must pass through the dryer/accumulator. in our system, after the split, where it goes to the two different cores (in parallel), they join back up again and pass through the accumulator, and then on to the compressor.

 

[JeffsLightning]

Just curious as to which has a larger evaporator which is what does the cooling right? Also if you look at my picture you will see a device tee'd into the return hose out of the intercooler that monitors the temp and displays it in my overhead console where the ambient temp reading use to be..:banana:

 

[Stewart_H]

Also if you look at my picture you will see a device tee'd into the return hose out of the intercooler that monitors the temp and displays it in my overhead console where the ambient temp reading use to be..:banana:

Aren't we all whores for readouts in our trucks?

Did that come with the IC system, or did you put it together?

Either way, it's good to see!

Stewart

 

[Stewart_H]

...in our system, after the split, where it goes to the two different cores (in parallel), they join back up again and pass through the accumulator, and then on to the compressor.

Ok, maybe I misread the directions posted a couple pages back, and since I'm not super familiar with the a/c system, it would be easy for me to be wrong, but according to the info posted by Jeff, the refrigerant coming from the IC evap core T's into the return line coming out of the accumulator, which means some refrigerant will always be bypassing the filtering system.

Someone with more knowledge than me please confirm or dismiss. It's my anniversary so I'm outta here. Gonna enjoy the day with my beautiful bride of 19 years!

Stewart

 

[Steve@TF]

are these going to go into production for us terminator guys??? if so, i would like to see some hard data on this system. i've been waiting for a while for this, it seems to have stalled out

not stalled out, just slowed down a little due to many other projects on the table. we've been test fitting the boxes for them recently. ill be posting pics in the terminator section soon.

Ok, maybe I misread the directions posted a couple pages back, and since I'm not super familiar with the a/c system, it would be easy for me to be wrong, but according to the info posted by Jeff, the refrigerant coming from the IC evap core T's into the return line coming out of the accumulator, which means some refrigerant will always be bypassing the filtering system.

Someone with more knowledge than me please confirm or dismiss. It's my anniversary so I'm outta here. Gonna enjoy the day with my beautiful bride of 19 years!

Stewart

ill be forwarding this to my buddy at his work. he'll review it and send me some info to address this for everyone.

 

[Steve@TF]

The receiver/dryer is not really a filter. It will tend to deposit any solids (assuming they get threw the orifice tube screen and the evaporator) at the bottom of the can, but its really purpose is to remove any moisture by use of a dessicant material and to prevent a slug of liquid refrigerant from going into the compressor. In the latter case, it performs just like the catch cans that people put on their crankcase ventilation system to trap oil solids. That said, R134 mixed with water does not form corrosive acid like R12 did, so R134 systems do not need dessicant in the receiver/dryers. Reference for this is www.v8sho.com, Care and Feeding of the Gen 3 SHO, Air Conditioning, A/C failures and how to prevent them.

Ford A/C systems use an orifice tube located in the liquid line. The orifice tube has a screen that acts as a filter for particulates. I am not sure if the expansion valve on the IR also contains a filter. Anyways, particulates in your a/c system means something is failing. Impurities can't get into the a/c system unless it is opened up.

The A/C system does have a WOT compressor shutoff. When the computer senses, from the TPS, a WOT condition, the A/C clutch is disengaged. This is because WOT is interpreted as a driver demand for maximum power (say, for passing) and the A/C compressor, when engaged, takes some engine power to operate.

 

[kirks5oh]

not stalled out, just slowed down a little due to many other projects on the table. we've been test fitting the boxes for them recently. ill be posting pics in the terminator section soon.
.

good

 

[Credit2NV]

Steve you still making this?
I'm a good friend of Kevin's.....so he told me about it but didnt know if you where going to make it or not..

I just got a 2003 "L"...so let me know....
Thanks,
Chris
Here in Texas

 

[runs2rch]

Steve you still making this?
I'm a good friend of Kevin's.....so he told me about it but didnt know if you where going to make it or not..

I just got a 2003 "L"...so let me know....
Thanks,
Chris
Here in Texas

Yes they are. Shoot Steve a Pm.