The vid is off YouTube but paul svinicki a pro late model driver through down a nasty et on d/r of [email protected]
Stock
Mach 1 vs M3
- Thread starter xsellr8
- Start date
The vid is off YouTube but paul svinicki a pro late model driver through down a nasty et on d/r of [email protected]
Stock
*This will probably be long so prepare yourselves*
Hello gentlemen, been watching SVT from behind the scenes for a few years and finally decided to sign up a few days ago after seeing this thread.
First off, it's getting more rare to see forums with kill sections so I tend to frequent the lot. Whether it be LS1, or whatever forum, if it has a kills section I am there. Really gets you to learn more about the other cars in the world as opposed to being centered on one certain brand.
Anyways, I'm not going to debate the Boss 302 vs E92 M3. I'm pretty sure it's been beaten to death enough. However, I am a true enthusiast and see greatness in both machines. The Boss is exactly that on the track. A BOSS! The Boss is very fast, agile but could be better, and has a huge amount of potential waiting to be unleashed. The Boss is simply a great car.
The M3 is a beast in its own ways as well but I won't even get on that subject because I may end up sounding biased. However, I will comment on some discrepancies regarding the E46 M3.
Most E46 M3's do dyno in the 300RWHP range with bolt ons. Simple bolt ons and a cann tune will definitely put you in the 300 rwhp range and it's quite simple using any off the shelf header, any x pipe, and and rear muffler section and a $400 cann tune from many various sites. Simply put, the majority of M3's on the road will use this method.
Now, that's not at all, the most you can get out of an E46 M3. E46's can and have been dynoing in the 320-360 rwhp range without touching the block and without cams. Yes, simple bolt ons, but the right bolt ons. See the dyno here. This dyno sheet is from a very very reputable company in the BMW tuning world and they produce some of the highest quality parts on the BMW market. Granted, that quality comes at a cost. This header alone is $2k and that's not the cheapest header on the market either. But, it's worth the costs ten fold. This dyno here shows a full bolt on E46 M3 using the same companies 3.5" straight exhaust. Most people do not even look into purchasing this exhaust because it's simply too loud for the road. But it's a performer and the most powerful exhaust on the market for the E46 M3. There's a lot and I mean a lot of people who run this exhaust on race only applications.
http://store.bimmerworld.com/epic-motorsports-e46-m3-header-p1939.aspx
Point here is, our cars can make the power, you really just need to put the money down on the right parts. We also have what is known as Alpha N tuning which is simply a MAF-less system. This alone is worth 20-40 rwhp. On many occassions people have replicated the same gains over and over but it depends on the setup and the tuner. Proof is here. Don't believe this one, google Alpha N tuning and the S54.
BimmerBoost - Evolve gains 46.8 wheel horsepower naturally aspirated on an E46 M3 S54 with their carbon airbox and Alpha-N tuning for a total of 326.8 wheel horsepower
Now, comparing the Mach 1 and the E46 M3. They are both very potent cars. Stock for stock both are low 13 cars with some glory runs into the 12's. However, when the Mach 1 adds gears, bolt ons, good tune and tires, we do not stand a chance in the 1/4 mile. The low end torque coupled to those gears is simply staggering. We can't go low 12's without a good bit of weight reduction, tire, gear, and a really really good driver like myself.But once the speeds are rolling, we definitely have the upper hand. No doubt about it. Our cars breath better in the higher rpms and our gearing is more suited for that style of driving. Not some German "it was built for the Autobahn" BS either.
The Mach 1 is a fun car to drive I am sure, as is my M3. I would never consider owning a Mach 1 but I would love to have one at an Autox or at an HPDE event and really ring it out. I tried to keep it somewhat short but I like to write I guess.
Thanks for the unbiased opinion
I had a post, but since I am new it said it had to be reviewed by a moderator. Hate being new on a forum.
Thanks. I'm just glad to see mature people here. Most kill sections are full of childish behavior.
*This will probably be long so prepare yourselves*
Hello gentlemen, been watching SVT from behind the scenes for a few years and finally decided to sign up a few days ago after seeing this thread.
First off, it's getting more rare to see forums with kill sections so I tend to frequent the lot. Whether it be LS1, or whatever forum, if it has a kills section I am there. Really gets you to learn more about the other cars in the world as opposed to being centered on one certain brand.
Anyways, I'm not going to debate the Boss 302 vs E92 M3. I'm pretty sure it's been beaten to death enough. However, I am a true enthusiast and see greatness in both machines. The Boss is exactly that on the track. A BOSS! The Boss is very fast, agile but could be better, and has a huge amount of potential waiting to be unleashed. The Boss is simply a great car.
The M3 is a beast in its own ways as well but I won't even get on that subject because I may end up sounding biased. However, I will comment on some discrepancies regarding the E46 M3.
Most E46 M3's do dyno in the 300RWHP range with bolt ons. Simple bolt ons and a cann tune will definitely put you in the 300 rwhp range and it's quite simple using any off the shelf header, any x pipe, and and rear muffler section and a $400 cann tune from many various sites. Simply put, the majority of M3's on the road will use this method.
Now, that's not at all, the most you can get out of an E46 M3. E46's can and have been dynoing in the 320-360 rwhp range without touching the block and without cams. Yes, simple bolt ons, but the right bolt ons. See the dyno here. This dyno sheet is from a very very reputable company in the BMW tuning world and they produce some of the highest quality parts on the BMW market. Granted, that quality comes at a cost. This header alone is $2k and that's not the cheapest header on the market either. But, it's worth the costs ten fold. This dyno here shows a full bolt on E46 M3 using the same companies 3.5" straight exhaust. Most people do not even look into purchasing this exhaust because it's simply too loud for the road. But it's a performer and the most powerful exhaust on the market for the E46 M3. There's a lot and I mean a lot of people who run this exhaust on race only applications.
http://store.bimmerworld.com/epic-motorsports-e46-m3-header-p1939.aspx
Point here is, our cars can make the power, you really just need to put the money down on the right parts. We also have what is known as Alpha N tuning which is simply a MAF-less system. This alone is worth 20-40 rwhp. On many occassions people have replicated the same gains over and over but it depends on the setup and the tuner. Proof is here. Don't believe this one, google Alpha N tuning and the S54.
BimmerBoost - Evolve gains 46.8 wheel horsepower naturally aspirated on an E46 M3 S54 with their carbon airbox and Alpha-N tuning for a total of 326.8 wheel horsepower
Now, comparing the Mach 1 and the E46 M3. They are both very potent cars. Stock for stock both are low 13 cars with some glory runs into the 12's. However, when the Mach 1 adds gears, bolt ons, good tune and tires, we do not stand a chance in the 1/4 mile. The low end torque coupled to those gears is simply staggering. We can't go low 12's without a good bit of weight reduction, tire, gear, and a really really good driver like myself.
The Mach 1 is a fun car to drive I am sure, as is my M3. I would never consider owning a Mach 1 but I would love to have one at an Autox or at an HPDE event and really ring it out. I tried to keep it somewhat short but I like to write I guess.
This post is spot on ... :beer:
I've never heard of a bone stock mach in the 12s but I believe til this day that it was possible to do so with the right weather, driver, and DA, just like the LS1 achieved.
Yea most guys here are reasonable, but if a story smells fishy it can get ugly as im sure you've witnessed when you were lurking.
*This will probably be long so prepare yourselves*
Hello gentlemen, been watching SVT from behind the scenes for a few years and finally decided to sign up a few days ago after seeing this thread.
First off, it's getting more rare to see forums with kill sections so I tend to frequent the lot. Whether it be LS1, or whatever forum, if it has a kills section I am there. Really gets you to learn more about the other cars in the world as opposed to being centered on one certain brand.
Anyways, I'm not going to debate the Boss 302 vs E92 M3. I'm pretty sure it's been beaten to death enough. However, I am a true enthusiast and see greatness in both machines. The Boss is exactly that on the track. A BOSS! The Boss is very fast, agile but could be better, and has a huge amount of potential waiting to be unleashed. The Boss is simply a great car.
The M3 is a beast in its own ways as well but I won't even get on that subject because I may end up sounding biased. However, I will comment on some discrepancies regarding the E46 M3.
Most E46 M3's do dyno in the 300RWHP range with bolt ons. Simple bolt ons and a cann tune will definitely put you in the 300 rwhp range and it's quite simple using any off the shelf header, any x pipe, and and rear muffler section and a $400 cann tune from many various sites. Simply put, the majority of M3's on the road will use this method.
Now, that's not at all, the most you can get out of an E46 M3. E46's can and have been dynoing in the 320-360 rwhp range without touching the block and without cams. Yes, simple bolt ons, but the right bolt ons. See the dyno here. This dyno sheet is from a very very reputable company in the BMW tuning world and they produce some of the highest quality parts on the BMW market. Granted, that quality comes at a cost. This header alone is $2k and that's not the cheapest header on the market either. But, it's worth the costs ten fold. This dyno here shows a full bolt on E46 M3 using the same companies 3.5" straight exhaust. Most people do not even look into purchasing this exhaust because it's simply too loud for the road. But it's a performer and the most powerful exhaust on the market for the E46 M3. There's a lot and I mean a lot of people who run this exhaust on race only applications.
http://store.bimmerworld.com/epic-motorsports-e46-m3-header-p1939.aspx
Point here is, our cars can make the power, you really just need to put the money down on the right parts. We also have what is known as Alpha N tuning which is simply a MAF-less system. This alone is worth 20-40 rwhp. On many occassions people have replicated the same gains over and over but it depends on the setup and the tuner. Proof is here. Don't believe this one, google Alpha N tuning and the S54.
BimmerBoost - Evolve gains 46.8 wheel horsepower naturally aspirated on an E46 M3 S54 with their carbon airbox and Alpha-N tuning for a total of 326.8 wheel horsepower
Now, comparing the Mach 1 and the E46 M3. They are both very potent cars. Stock for stock both are low 13 cars with some glory runs into the 12's. However, when the Mach 1 adds gears, bolt ons, good tune and tires, we do not stand a chance in the 1/4 mile. The low end torque coupled to those gears is simply staggering. We can't go low 12's without a good bit of weight reduction, tire, gear, and a really really good driver like myself.
The Mach 1 is a fun car to drive I am sure, as is my M3. I would never consider owning a Mach 1 but I would love to have one at an Autox or at an HPDE event and really ring it out. I tried to keep it somewhat short but I like to write I guess.
Good post. I like bimmer guys that arent arrogant cocky pricks.
Welcome to svtp, good sir. There have been afew machs that ran high 12s bone stock, but yes, they are hero passes. I know of 3.
Im HPDE lvl 3 and Ive done alittle road racing in my mach. Its eaton swapped making 500 whp and Ive run it with toyo proxes r888s and one coil cut off the stock springs all the way around. With these tires and the cars lower center of gravity it handles ALOT better. The body roll is almost non existent and its easy to tell when the car hits its limit, but even when it does you can still powerslide it around a corner without alot of effort on the throttle. Ive been driving a mach for 8 years so I know the car very well at this point. Other than cutting the springs the suspension is stock. I do plan to set it up for road racing. Id love to take an M3 around a track.
Good post. I like bimmer guys that arent arrogant cocky pricks.
There have been afew machs that ran high 12s bone stock, but yes, they are hero passes. I know of 3.
Im HPDE lvl 3 and Ive done alittle road racing in my mach. Its eaton swapped making 500 whp and Ive run it with toyo proxes r888s and one coil cut off the stock springs all the way around. With these tires and the cars lower center of gravity it handles ALOT better. The body roll is almost non existent and its easy to tell when the car hits its limit, but even when it does you can still powerslide it around a corner without alot of effort on the throttle. Ive been driving a mach for 8 years so I know the car very well at this point. Other than cutting the springs the suspension is stock. I do plan to set it up for road racing. Id love to take an M3 around a track.
Appreciate it. Sounds like your Mach has a decent setup. I'm going to step up to R888's when I feel I am more capable with my Hankook V12's and feel the RS3's are inferior to the R888's; for now the extra costs and somewhat better dry traction is holding me back. I'm not at a driving level for the R888's anyway so I will stick to the RS3's or PS2's next.
Lol, yea, sometimes I would really want to comment, but would just sit back and enjoy the laughter.
You will not be disappointed, the R888s are the best tire Ive ever had. They are super predictable. You know when they are gonna break loose and can prepare easily for it, but their limits are quite high. Plus, their straight line grip is ridiculously good.
My car goes down tomorrow for a ton of upgrades and hopefully quite abit more power.
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You will not be disappointed, the R888s are the best tire Ive ever had. They are super predictable. You know when they are gonna break loose and can prepare easily for it, but their limits are quite high. Plus, their straight line grip is ridiculously good.
My car goes down tomorrow for a ton of upgrades and hopefully quite abit more power.
Nice. I might go for them. Going to see how they do in the wet first. The thing I love about the Hankooks though. Feel like this thread is being slowly derailed but, I love the Hankooks for their versatility. I've driven my V12's in the snow, 1.9's at the strip, and am about to Autox on them. It's so much fun and they're cheap. Much cheaper than my older Z1 star specs and pretty much any other tire with its performance. Love the tires.
Yes, and thank you for the change in direction. I want to try a pair of those 888s on my Cobra now
Paul ran that time on drag radials... I was talking bone stock. ;-)
:beer: Mathews is one hell of a driver.
The guy ran that 12.7 in the M3 ran in January at Atco.. a Mach 1 probably would go 12s easy in the same conditions.. I saw the DA touch -4xxx here over the winter months... I bet he had extremely good air to run in.
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This is out of my Mustang book. It's probably the run on DRs
Saw this in there too. Don't know how the 2 BMWs got into that race...they arent in the same class...but they're behind the Mustang. Nothing new.
Saw this in there too. Don't know how the 2 BMWs got into that race...they arent in the same class...but they're behind the Mustang. Nothing new.
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Yea I've talked to him on our forum as well. His car was a real stripper model. Weighed 32xx lbs in factory trim. Mine is 3420 exactly w/o me in it. Huge difference but I have every option including nav, heated seats, etc.
My little 135i loves the JB4 G4 board! What a blast to select so many boost, a/f, user adjustable programs with meth, on top of catless DPs and inter-cooler. All this from the steering wheel control buttons.
I am biased but I was an 03 Cobra owner too.
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This is why I went out and purchased both breeds... I now have a '99 M3 and a '90 notchback sitting in the driveway. The Mustang is the fun car. Loud, raw and just begging to be heard. The M3 is the cruiser. Much more comfortable, much quieter but still every bit as exciting to drive and a little quicker than the fox.
Both cars still put a smile on my face every time I go for a ride. I take the M3 on trips and when the weather is bad, the Mustang is for sunny days and joy rides through the mountains. If anyone has the opportunity I highly recommend driving a car from the other side. Our M-cars may not be as fast as modern Mustangs but I think they'll still put a big grin on your face when you start to play with 'em.
Both cars still put a smile on my face every time I go for a ride. I take the M3 on trips and when the weather is bad, the Mustang is for sunny days and joy rides through the mountains. If anyone has the opportunity I highly recommend driving a car from the other side. Our M-cars may not be as fast as modern Mustangs but I think they'll still put a big grin on your face when you start to play with 'em.
Ive had a set of hankooks before. They make good tires. Mine were the ventus, but I dont remember which model of tire they were. I was cutting 1.71 60 foots on my R888s. Thats freakin ridiculous for a non drag radial tire. I was also launching at idle so this was with no burnout and no high rpm launches. My rear is still stock so i cant get crazy with the launches yet.
They perform ok in the wet. On a prepped track they do well in the wet. On a rainy day on the street they will do fine in every day driving, but I wouldnt recommend any real spirited driving on the average road on a rainy day as they will slip.
Their dry traction is phenomenal tho and I would venture to say unbeatable when comparing them to any other DOT legal tire.
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