Finally going to start installing "new" DC heads. Need advice

[MalcolmV8]

Ed Schraider says not to take them past 75ft/lbs or you stand a serious chance of destroying them brand new. I guess stay below that if you don't want issues. There was a thread on modular ford about them, where one member said you could even see the stretching in them. To me I wouldn't risk messing with them when for $100 more you get the better ones.

Well back in the day ARP 2000s didn't exist when I got the standard ones

85 ft/lb is the magic number. ARP's torque spec for that size stud is 90 ft/lb. However john mihovetz has done extensive testing from low torque numbers all the way up to where he was distorting the mains and even ripping the threads right out of the blocks. 85 is the magic number you want to be at for our 4.6 motors.

 

[NateDogg]

Do you have a car lift?

No sir. We had it on jack stands, and used the cherry picker to loft the car the extra little bit we needed. I did drop the k member and get it out of the way first.

After that was gone, we sat the tranny and engine on a furniture dolly and it slid right our the passenger side.

 

[cj428mach]

Well back in the day ARP 2000s didn't exist when I got the standard ones

85 ft/lb is the magic number. ARP's torque spec for that size stud is 90 ft/lb. However john mihovetz has done extensive testing from low torque numbers all the way up to where he was distorting the mains and even ripping the threads right out of the blocks. 85 is the magic number you want to be at for our 4.6 motors.

So it sounds like the 8470's should be avoided then, in the thread I was reading ARP has revised down their torque number on them from 100ft/lb, to 90, now down to 80ft/lbs probably because people were destroying them.

Get your motor back from the machine shop yet?

 

[jrgoffin]

So it sounds like the 8470's should be avoided then, in the thread I was reading ARP has revised down their torque number on them from 100ft/lb, to 90, now down to 80ft/lbs probably because people were destroying them.

Get your motor back from the machine shop yet?

There are pics in my build thread of stretched 8740's. If you are spending the money to build one of these expensive engines, it's a no-brainer to add a bit more and go with the 2000's. For the aluminum blocks at least, the "Mihovitz" number for final torque is 80 ft/lbs.

 

[MalcolmV8]

For the aluminum blocks at least, the "Mihovitz" number for final torque is 80 ft/lbs.

I spoke to him personally on the phone about the head studs and various issues he told me 85 ft/lb.

 

[jrgoffin]

My mistake - 85 is correct and what I also used. I was thinking of the number that the 8740's were known to stretch at. All fine with the 2000's at 85 on mine as well...

 

[MalcolmV8]

My mistake - 85 is correct and what I also used. I was thinking of the number that the 8740's were known to stretch at. All fine with the 2000's at 85 on mine as well...

All good man!

 

[NateDogg]

Do you have a car lift?

Aren't you near tampa? There are two 05 aviator motors for sale on Craigslist for 300..

Could make a decent amount if you sell the heads off of them.

 

[IllCobra]

I saw that post! I am strongly considering buying them buying but i'm still trying to get this motor done. I bought my cobra from guy in tampa, i'm near vero beach.

 

[IllCobra]

End of day 2. Got the motor and trans out. Wasn't too bad except for the driver side header giving us a little more trouble when removing; those bolts were a PITA to remove. Unfortunately, we had one hiccup while removing the trans from the motor. Me and my brother where both tired and it was late with crappy lighting which ended in us cracking the bell housing smh luckily i found one on ebay for $200.

Out and mounted!

Was told by the guy i bought the car from that it had a Steeda shifter - this does not look like a Steeda shifter....

SPEC clutch looks like it's on its last legs... Can anyone confirm?

Pulled parts. I plan on getting the headers sandblasted and ceramic coated.

 

[IllCobra]

Aren't you near tampa? There are two 05 aviator motors for sale on Craigslist for 300..

Could make a decent amount if you sell the heads off of them.

Was texting with the guy, they are the DB casting heads, which makes me doubt that the motors are off a 2005 aviator. Still seems like a great deal

 

[cj428mach]

Glad you got the darn thing out but that sucks about the bell housing. I think you got lucky though as I've seen some bell housing go for much more than that.

I hope the lower comes off easily as it can be tough to remove with the motor out. I was having trouble getting mine off with the motor in the car so I just decided I'd try to get it with the engine out and an impact. I tried using a 1" impact but the motor just kept spinning. I then built a flywheel stop and the impact still wouldn't budge the lower. Finally I just had to get a large cheater pipe which I sat on the end of it while smacking the cheater with a hammer.

It was a tad scary putting that much force on the old engine stand but I had to get the lower off to do the head swap.

 

[MalcolmV8]

I hope the lower comes off easily as it can be tough to remove with the motor out. I was having trouble getting mine off with the motor in the car so I just decided I'd try to get it with the engine out and an impact. I tried using a 1" impact but the motor just kept spinning. I then built a flywheel stop and the impact still wouldn't budge the lower. Finally I just had to get a large cheater pipe which I sat on the end of it while smacking the cheater with a hammer.

It was a tad scary putting that much force on the old engine stand but I had to get the lower off to do the head swap.

Yeah same here cheater bar with a hammer does it with a flywheel locking tool in place (home made). I have my son stand on the engine stand and brace it as I feel like I'm going to hammer the whole motor over onto the ground lol.

We've done it so many times now we have a process down. It's a 6' piece of square tubing that goes over the breaker bar that my buddy pulls down hard with some pressure while my son is on the engine stand and then one massive slam with the hammer and boom its off.

 

[IllCobra]

Glad you got the darn thing out but that sucks about the bell housing. I think you got lucky though as I've seen some bell housing go for much more than that.

I hope the lower comes off easily as it can be tough to remove with the motor out. I was having trouble getting mine off with the motor in the car so I just decided I'd try to get it with the engine out and an impact. I tried using a 1" impact but the motor just kept spinning. I then built a flywheel stop and the impact still wouldn't budge the lower. Finally I just had to get a large cheater pipe which I sat on the end of it while smacking the cheater with a hammer.

It was a tad scary putting that much force on the old engine stand but I had to get the lower off to do the head swap.

Yeah same here cheater bar with a hammer does it with a flywheel locking tool in place (home made). I have my son stand on the engine stand and brace it as I feel like I'm going to hammer the whole motor over onto the ground lol.

We've done it so many times now we have a process down. It's a 6' piece of square tubing that goes over the breaker bar that my buddy pulls down hard with some pressure while my son is on the engine stand and then one massive slam with the hammer and boom its off.

Awe, crap! I forgot about how hard the lower is. And here I thought the hard parts were over. Well, let's see how this goes haha

 

[TheFleshRocket]

I've gotta ask--what's so bad about pulling the heads with the engine in the car? Pulling the engine / trans seems like a lot of work and seeing the motor with the supercharger and intercooler removed makes head removal look not all that bad from my semi-layman perspective.

 

[MalcolmV8]

I've gotta ask--what's so bad about pulling the heads with the engine in the car? Pulling the engine / trans seems like a lot of work and seeing the motor with the supercharger and intercooler removed makes head removal look not all that bad from my semi-layman perspective.

I've done it both ways. Its much quicker to just pull the motor and then pull the heads. In the engine bay is a massive non stop battle. You have to pull the brake booster, loosen motor mounts, jack motor at times, struggle with exhaust manifolds in that cramped space. Front accessories, damper, and timing cover must all come off. Much less fun bending over a fender doing it.

 

[TheFleshRocket]

I've done it both ways. Its much quicker to just pull the motor and then pull the heads. In the engine bay is a massive non stop battle. You have to pull the brake booster, loosen motor mounts, jack motor at times, struggle with exhaust manifolds in that cramped space. Front accessories, damper, and timing cover must all come off. Much less fun bending over a fender doing it.

Ballpark, what kind of time are we talking about for doing it each way? Assuming someone who has moderate mechanical skill but has never pulled a motor or a head before.

 

[hotcobra03]

I've gotta ask--what's so bad about pulling the heads with the engine in the car? Pulling the engine / trans seems like a lot of work and seeing the motor with the supercharger and intercooler removed makes head removal look not all that bad from my semi-layman perspective.

I did my drivers head over fender thinking it be faster than pulling..

Depending on if you can work like that..it's a couple hrs bent over..

I have bbk long tubes..found I was able to leave header attached both out and in..

My worry is last time I pulled engine and was able to clean oil pickup and tube thru to oil cooler..had a mess all the way from old silicone and timing chain track plastic ..

 

[IllCobra]

Ballpark, what kind of time are we talking about for doing it each way? Assuming someone who has moderate mechanical skill but has never pulled a motor or a head before.

Pulling the motor actually wasn't that bad. The hardest part was removing the LT headers as the bolts were a pita. And as others have said, removing from the top like i did is a little more difficult than going underneath.

 

[Nightmare302]

I typically spend 6-10 hours pulling an engine depending on how many bolts want to be a bitch or not in my driveway using an engine hoist to lift the front and drop the factory k to dollies. This can be reduced with helpers and aftermarket K and now with my tube front I can do it very very quickly.