Any updates on this?
GT350 manifold on a 11-14 engine
- Thread starter cozmo2806
- Start date
Still waiting on SCT to release the necessary parameters for tuning a 15+ throttle body on the 11-14 cars. Otherwise I'm ready to go.
Keep in mind we (MMR) also have a adapter to use the 11-14 TB on the GT350 manifold for those that do not want to wait - they can be ordered here:
http://www.modularmotorsportsracing...page=product_info&cPath=28_29&products_id=837
http://www.modularmotorsportsracing...page=product_info&cPath=28_29&products_id=837
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^^^^probably the best option at the moment. I recall a post/thread somewhere else about a shop running the GT350 manifold on a bolt-on S550. They had some tuning issues with the GT350 TB and the car put down pretty low TQ numbers. They switched to the stock TB and car responded well, TQ was up 20-25lbs as well and was within 5 or so HP of the bigger 87mm TB. Think it simply boils down to tuning issues with that TB at the moment.
SCT still has not released the necessary parameters for tuning 11-14 cars with the 87mm TB and still no ETA on when it might happen. So, had a conversation with Shaun and decided to stick with the stock 80 TB for now as Sssnake suggested. Ordered the MMR adapter today so hopefully will get started on the actual swap sometime next week. Shaun felt at this point it would be easy to retune since most of his effort was around the GT350 TB and the manifold is very similar in design to a GT intake. Another option we discussed is the 84.5 FR/Accufab TB but at over $500 this isn't a very budget friendly starting point. Still, for a drag racing effort the bigger TB will likely offer some gains. But in my case the car is used more for track days than anything else. And here he believes the stock TB is actually an advantage for tuning part throttle drivability, like coming out of corners on the track.
As I mentioned prior, the GT350 intake opening would accept a 90mm TB so perhaps this is an option in a max effort NA build as well. I didn't discuss this option with him. But after going through the various options with Shaun he still strongly believes the CJ setup is the way to any NA drag race type build, even over any GT350/TB combo. Which was pretty well documented on the VMP GT350/CJ swap front page article.
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In for the results.
Excellent, I look forward to seeing your results! FWIW you could also look at picking up, or porting the stock TB as well. This guy opens them up to 85mm, tempted to pick one up myself, or pick up a used TB and try my hand at porting.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/PORTED-COYO...ash=item3ac0179a5f:g:XW0AAOSwZtJW83pt&vxp=mtr
His FB page
https://www.facebook.com/GPE-Gigs-Performance-Engineering-1554710394790575/
any updates?
There is also this guy. I picked up an extra throttle body for 2011-2014 Mustang GT for $49 on ebay last year......just saying.
www.maxbore.com
Good info, thank you, always like options!
MMR adapter came in today. Unfortunately the rest of my week is pretty rough, so probably start the swap on Monday. Not expecting it to be too crazy since I'm using the stock TB, but never know.
Ok can't wait to see how it turns out. Rough weeks suck btw
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In for results!
Finished the intake install last Friday and loaded Shaun's base tune. Install was pretty straightforward even compared to some of the S550 write-ups. You will need to extend the purge valve wiring about 3" since it's now dead center vertical on the intake. It seems very likely it was offset on the base manifold to help the cover clear. All the vacuum hoses will fit with minor effort, although you do have to plug a few extra holes in the manifold. I also had to shorten the silicone tb coupler to adjust for the MMR adapter so that the intake tube would sit properly. You can see the adapter installed behind the tb. It's very well made and fitment was perfect, so thanks MMR. The coolant hose guides will no longer fit as the manifold mounts sit about 1/2" higher. You could actually flip them over and switch sides with the guides but then it interferes with the cover.
By far the most difficult part of the install is refitting the engine cover, which is still in progress. After trying a few things I decided to drill some holes and mount the cover with longer Boss 302 studs and nuts to retain. You can see the 4 holes in some of the pictures. Have some foam cut for the underside for the cover to rest against the manifold. I also had to flip the hard booster vacuum line over to make a little more room. Still waiting for the studs to arrive so I can finish the mounting. If it doesn't look right I may order the GT350 side covers and see how they look instead.
Butt dyno says it definitely pulls harder in the upper ranges and will pull right to 7500rpm where the rev limiter is now set. Had my first occurrence of the clutch sticking to the pressure plate while playing around in 2nd gear, presumably due to the higher RPM's. Very hard to be subjective about the lower RPM ranges. If it's making less torque across the curve I can't tell yet. I can say that it seems a little less progressive now as you get on the throttle. It hits a certain throttle point and opens up hard. Not sure if this can be rectified as we make tune revisions, but something I'm noticing. Still running the stock 83mm tb and need to discuss ported vs one of the aftermarket options again with Shaun. Still no update on SCT support for the GT350 tb. Need to schedule a dyno session but should take place within a week or so. May do a little logging and hopefully get a tune revision from Shaun in the meantime.
By far the most difficult part of the install is refitting the engine cover, which is still in progress. After trying a few things I decided to drill some holes and mount the cover with longer Boss 302 studs and nuts to retain. You can see the 4 holes in some of the pictures. Have some foam cut for the underside for the cover to rest against the manifold. I also had to flip the hard booster vacuum line over to make a little more room. Still waiting for the studs to arrive so I can finish the mounting. If it doesn't look right I may order the GT350 side covers and see how they look instead.
Butt dyno says it definitely pulls harder in the upper ranges and will pull right to 7500rpm where the rev limiter is now set. Had my first occurrence of the clutch sticking to the pressure plate while playing around in 2nd gear, presumably due to the higher RPM's. Very hard to be subjective about the lower RPM ranges. If it's making less torque across the curve I can't tell yet. I can say that it seems a little less progressive now as you get on the throttle. It hits a certain throttle point and opens up hard. Not sure if this can be rectified as we make tune revisions, but something I'm noticing. Still running the stock 83mm tb and need to discuss ported vs one of the aftermarket options again with Shaun. Still no update on SCT support for the GT350 tb. Need to schedule a dyno session but should take place within a week or so. May do a little logging and hopefully get a tune revision from Shaun in the meantime.
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Awesome I hope dyno session shows good improvements
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Our pleasure, thank you!
I cannot wait for results, most of us have seen the results for S550s, however AFAIK you are the 1st with an S197 to do it. Thank you :beer: !
Shaun reviewed the logs and added 2 degrees of timing, otherwise no changes from his base tune. Car is scheduled for the dyno Friday morning so will see what it was all worth soon enough.
Dyno'd the car with overlays this morning and it worked out about as well as one could hope! Lost no more than 3½ ft/lbs torque down low and just took off after 4700rpm. Oddly enough, it even gained 10-15 ft/lbs torque between 2500 and 3000rpm. 30 hp gain at the peak but up to 45 hp at the higher RPM’s. Shaun had set the rev limited at 7500rpm which is probably fine for what I'm doing now. Also have an Excel plotting of the dyno runs but the docs provided didn’t have RPM included. Hoping to get a revised copy. As I mentioned prior, the motion control valves are pinned open and obviously not affecting the full throttle numbers at any RPM. Also still using the stock 80mm throttle body for all runs.
FYI, this was a Mainline brand dyno and tends to be very conservative compared to some others. So the number are typically much lower than what you would expect to see on a Dynojet. As per my prior post, last year I dyno'd my car at the Ford Carlisle show and it was about 20hp higher. Take it for what it's worth.
I have Kooks long tube headers going on next, will be curious to see how much it helps.
Blue is the GT manifold, red is the GT350. In case it wasn't obvious
FYI, this was a Mainline brand dyno and tends to be very conservative compared to some others. So the number are typically much lower than what you would expect to see on a Dynojet. As per my prior post, last year I dyno'd my car at the Ford Carlisle show and it was about 20hp higher. Take it for what it's worth.
I have Kooks long tube headers going on next, will be curious to see how much it helps.
Blue is the GT manifold, red is the GT350. In case it wasn't obvious
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