New Shelby GT350R or New GTR - same price

[Voltwings]

We live in Houston, so since TX2k became a GT-R fest, even my fiance' isnt impressed with the GT-R anymore, they are literally a dime a dozen. Now, literally every person in my family drives stick, my mom, my dad, me, my fiance, my sister ... we are a driving family; my Dad, my fiance' and i also go to road courses several times a year so my option is clearly the GT350(R). 1. The GT-R is incredible, but i feel its not a driver's car, its a car that can drive itself around a track, it just needs some monkey behind the wheel to get it started.

The GT-R is an incredible machine, sure, but it just doesn't do it for me. Like when Top Gear reviewed the Mclaren MP4-12c, they mentioned that it is an incredible machine, but that it lacks "soul" or "feeling" or just something that makes it special. I feel that's what the GT-R is, its a computer on wheels that lacks character, lacks "soul."

I'm sure someone toting how much "fun" their 1000 whp GT-R is is going to have a gripe with my statement, but its my statement and i stand by it. 2. I promise i am having a lot more fun in my 120 whp miata around a road course than you are with your 1000 whp GT-R in a straight line. By the way, i have driven several fast cars in a straight line, so unless you've also been around a road course, then your argument is invalid

OP just has to decide if he wants to drive, or be driven. The cars aren't really comparable at all, so that's basically all it comes down to.

Driving fast in a straight line isnt the only thing the GTR is good at. While anyone can claim they have more skill because they can drive a manual (no shit, so could my 65 year old mother). How many can back up their claims of having skill, are your lap times close to a semi pro driver? Same analogy goes to motorcycle riding, sure you can ride a bike shift/down shift, but how many can drag their knees on corners and clock times equivalent to a semi pro rider?

3. The R will hold some decent times, but it will not beat an equally driven GTR. I'm talking about same driver same day. Remember, the GTR is competition for the C7 Z06. The GTR and GT350R might have a comparison when it comes to interior styling, but performance it wont look good for the R.

I like the GT350/R, but i respect what the GTR can do, especially for how large the vehicle is. If i had a choice to own both, I'd own the more expensive car and trade it in for a 1 of 1 configured 2016 Viper.

A closer comparison would be a GT350R vs the Porsche Cayman GT4.

You seem to have missed the point of my post entirely, but i'll recap for you.

1. Tell me i'm wrong? Tell my the GT-R isnt a computer on wheels. I never once have denied what it is capable of, but it is not a Driver's car. By the way, your statement that your grandmother can drive stick is just silly, because mine does drive an automatic ...

2. Here i mentioned fun. Whether you are driving your 1000 whp GT-r in a straight line, or it is driving you around a track, i am having more fun driving my little miata around a road course. The miata forces you to be a better driver since you dont have AWD, a lot of horsepower, a lot of electronics ... as a crutch. If you blow a corner, you have to claw to get time back. No, i am not a pro, but again, the point was ultimately what is more fun.

3. Lastly, you are comparing magazine numbers and what the car is capable of doing. Thats fine, but again, what is it the OP wants to do? Drive or be driven? You can say the GT-R competes with a z06, GT3, or whatever else, but thats not what is being discussed here, we are discussing what you actually want to drive. If you're happy sitting down and bench racing what your car can do, then get a GT-R, but if you actually want to drive then get a GT350.

Now, i 100% respect and acknowledge the fact that not everyone goes to the road course with the same mentality and fervor that we do. Some people just want to go once or twice to check it out, and by all means more power to them. Just be aware that electronics and nannies will only take you so far, my fiance' has eaten Porches, GT-rs, BMW m3s, and an Audi R8 alive in her (granted, relatively modded) 2014 v6 mustang. So again, does OP want to drive, or be driven?

 

[Serpent]

You seem to have missed the point of my post entirely, but i'll recap for you.

1. Tell me i'm wrong? Tell my the GT-R isnt a computer on wheels. I never once have denied what it is capable of, but it is not a Driver's car. By the way, your statement that your grandmother can drive stick is just silly, because mine does drive an automatic ...

2. Here i mentioned fun. Whether you are driving your 1000 whp GT-r in a straight line, or it is driving you around a track, i am having more fun driving my little miata around a road course. The miata forces you to be a better driver since you dont have AWD, a lot of horsepower, a lot of electronics ... as a crutch. If you blow a corner, you have to claw to get time back. No, i am not a pro, but again, the point was ultimately what is more fun.

3. Lastly, you are comparing magazine numbers and what the car is capable of doing. Thats fine, but again, what is it the OP wants to do? Drive or be driven? You can say the GT-R competes with a z06, GT3, or whatever else, but thats not what is being discussed here, we are discussing what you actually want to drive. If you're happy sitting down and bench racing what your car can do, then get a GT-R, but if you actually want to drive then get a GT350.

Juggling a few things at work so bear with me.

I skimmed through your post, all i remember reading was
-There are tons of GTR's in Houston.
-You are having more fun with a miata then someone driving a 1000hp GTR in a straightline.
-You've driven several fast cars on a road course.

I responded because you did not mention a GTR being driven on the track.
I'm not disagreeing that the GTR is computer controlled. Just wanted to point out you will get better times in a GTR at the expense of the car doing all the work. Also, just because you drive a manual, doesnt automatically make you skilled. My mom who is 65, can drive a stick. I bet there are quite a few GTR owners that came from 3 pedal cars too.

Now, i 100% respect and acknowledge the fact that not everyone goes to the road course with the same mentality and fervor that we do. Some people just want to go once or twice to check it out, and by all means more power to them. Just be aware that electronics and nannies will only take you so far, my fiance' has eaten Porches, GT-rs, BMW m3s, and an Audi R8 alive in her (granted, relatively modded) 2014 v6 mustang. So again, does OP want to drive, or be driven?

I'm quite aware of what DCT cars can do in comparison to what manual 6 speed cars can do. The only exception to the rule is the new Viper ACR. Electronics and nannies will take you further than you can go then the traditional 6 speed, sorry but thats just technology moving forward. For your example of your girlfriend beating other drivers, she beat the driver not the car, also not really fair comparing stock vs modified. :shrug:

I'm not hating on mustangs, but the Mustang in general is just in a lower league. Just look at what the car's lap times can clock in comparison to other cars with the same driver. Also, look at the other forms of racing, the mustang is in the slower, lower league.
The average driver will not be able to utilize 100% of any car. That's where the GTR shines. That's where DCT cars shine, it takes the human error/slowness out of the equation. And yes, at the expense of "fun"/driver involvement.

Trust me, I'm a huge fan of driving a manual, I love the Viper and the ACR. But if the ACR had a DCT it would be a second or two faster.

 

[Voltwings]

Juggling a few things at work so bear with me.

I skimmed through your post, all i remember reading was
-There are tons of GTR's in Houston.
-You are having more fun with a miata then someone driving a 1000hp GTR in a straightline.
-You've driven several fast cars on a road course. No, just in a straight line. My road course experience is with rather run of the mill cars.

I responded because you did not mention a GTR being driven on the track.
I'm not disagreeing that the GTR is computer controlled. Just wanted to point out you will get better times in a GTR at the expense of the car doing all the work. Also, just because you drive a manual, doesnt automatically make you skilled. My mom who is 65, can drive a stick. I bet there are quite a few GTR owners that came from 3 pedal cars too.



Your girlfriend beat the driver not the car. I'm not hating on mustangs, but the Mustang in general is just in a lower league. Just look at what the car's lap times can clock in comparison to other cars with the same driver.
The average driver will not be able to utilize the car 100%. Thats where the GTR shines. Thats where DCT cars shine, it takes the human error/slowness out of the equation. And yes, at the expense of "fun"/driver involvement.

Trust me, I'm a huge fan of driving a manual, I love the Viper and the ACR. But if the ACR had a DCT it would be a second or two faster.

OK, i think you and i are just on two completely different pages. I wasn't strictly talking about what the car is capable of doing, but since for the second time you've mentioned your mother driving stick, i will comment on that. Just because you drive stick does not make you skilled is a 100% correct statement. However, driving an automatic with a slick dual clutch transmission takes even considerably less skill. Trying to juggle 3 pedals coming into turn 1 at 100+ mph is much more demanding than just braking and clicking a paddle shifter once or twice ... So i guess at this point i should broaden my view of the opposing argument. If purely clicking off lower lap times is where you find enjoyment, then you are probably more likely to find them in the GT-R. If, like any sport, working out, etc, you like seeing incremental gains through putting in effort and work, you will likely find more enjoyment in the GT350. I feel thats a pretty fair statement.

Secondly, my fiance' beating the driver and not the car was exactly my point, you even highlighted the part where i said "electronics and nannies will only take you so far." Despite how good a car is, you still have to be somewhat competent behind the wheel. Sure, you still have to know the line in a GT-R, know what the car can and cant handle, but it really is still doing a lot of the work for you.

 

[thomas91169]

My mom who is 65, can drive a stick.

Pics of mom?............



j/k, payback from the other thread lol.

 

[MovingZen]

That's how I feel. I mean look at this - this car is beyond drop dead sexy:

And the 350r sounds better imo.

 

[FortLewisCobra]

How about a Viper? Their supposed to be discounted pretty heavily right now.

 

[ON D BIT]

A closer comparison would be a GT350R vs the Porsche Cayman GT4.

No, a 991 GT3.

Randy has already said the he likes the R more. Plus times are equal with the GT3.
Good thing the GTR skips the GT3 and is a competitor to the turbo s.

 

[blk02edge]

For the automatic fans, why does it even matter if the car is 1 second faster? Do you get honest real enjoyment out of such an irrelevant amount of measurement? I highly doubt many if any actually track their cars at the skill level where it matters.

Imo it's as stupid as magazine bench racing a stock camaro vs a stock mustang. I feel like to most people nowadays cars are more about look what I have rather than look what I can do and frankly it's going to ruin the future of cars.


I can fully understand for a street car if you just cant be bothered to shift but I can not understand the point for track days

 

[SVT-BansheeMan]

Ask this on a gtr forum.

 

[blk02edge]

I see the term "boring" thrown around a lot, just google GTR/boring lol. I read people trading them in for 370z's m3's vipers...etc so it's obviously a thing, I feel like lots of people who dumped that kind of money are just too proud to admit it or don't actually care because it gets attention.

 

[Sirraf]

The amount of hate for GTRs in this thread is mind boggling. Especially considering it would beat 95% of poster's cars in stock form in every facet of driving. If the GT350 had awd and dual clutch auto trans, there would be nut swinging left and right. Granted this is a Mustang forum, but holy shit lol.

 

[Sirraf]

I see the term "boring" thrown around a lot, just google GTR/boring lol. I read people trading them in for 370z's m3's vipers...etc so it's obviously a thing, I feel like lots of people who dumped that kind of money are just too proud to admit it or don't actually care because it gets attention.

edit

 

[Wildman113]

You must not have gone to many track days if these are your thoughts on the GTR's on track performance. Any monkey can take an incredible machine and turn it into complete poop on a race track. Doesn't make that machine any worse in the grand scheme of things.

A manual RWD car might be a little bit more fun to drive and it will take a more skilled driver to perfect, but it will not hold a candle to a well driven GTR on the track. AWD handling/grip with great power and slick shifting auto trans is going to destroy anyone in a manual RWD car not named Senna.

Obviously YOU must be living under a rock. The GT-R, with it's complex AWD system, flappy paddle gearbox, and computer aided handling/traction systems has gotten it's ass kicked by the Camaro Z/28, and the NISMO version got it's ass handed to it by the Corvette Z06. Both cost less and don't blow up/overheat/melt down their transmissions after a few laps on the track like the GT-R. And yes, those are MANUAL transmission equipped RWD performance cars. Not a computer aided AWD, flappy paddle automatic, 4,000lb boat designed for people who can't drive a real car.

I'll spell it out for you since you obviously haven't been out of the house in a while:

The GT-R can't hold a candle to a well driven manual transmission equipped car like the Z/28 and Z06 on the track. The verdict is out on the GT350R, but considering its weight advantage over the GT-R it will be no surprise if that annihilates the GT-R as well.

 

[Wildman113]

The amount of hate for GTRs in this thread is mind boggling. Especially considering it would beat 95% of poster's cars in stock form in every facet of driving. If the GT350 had awd and dual clutch auto trans, there would be nut swinging left and right. Granted this is a Mustang forum, but holy shit lol.

Maybe if you'd stop trolling about how perfect you think your GT-R is, people might have a little more respect.

Your car can't destroy even 10% of the cars on their website, because your car can't make it around a track more than about one lap without overheating or breaking down. Not that you've ever been to a track, as it's quite obvious that you spend more time trolling Mustang forums than you do actually driving your car. Of course, that about what is expected from a GT-R owner.

You were described in a previous post by another member, I'll give you a hint:

He posted a picture of a shirt.

 

[Sirraf]

Obviously YOU must be living under a rock. The GT-R, with it's complex AWD system, flappy paddle gearbox, and computer aided handling/traction systems has gotten it's ass kicked by the Camaro Z/28, and the NISMO version got it's ass handed to it by the Corvette Z06. Both cost less and don't blow up/overheat/melt down their transmissions after a few laps on the track like the GT-R. And yes, those are MANUAL transmission equipped RWD performance cars. Not a computer aided AWD, flappy paddle automatic, 4,000lb boat designed for people who can't drive a real car.

I'll spell it out for you since you obviously haven't been out of the house in a while:

The GT-R can't hold a candle to a well driven manual transmission equipped car like the Z/28 and Z06 on the track. The verdict is out on the GT350R, but considering its weight advantage over the GT-R it will be no surprise if that annihilates the GT-R as well.

You have no idea what you are talking about dude. You do realize the GT350 only weight about 150 pounds less than the GTR. Mine weighed 3822 with fuel. Again, what experience do you have with any cars that you have mentioned? Have you drove or owned any of them?

 

[Sirraf]

Maybe if you'd being a cocky asshole and trolling about your GT-R, people might have a little more respect.

Your car can't destroy even 10% of the cars on their website, because your car can't make it around a track more than about one lap without overheating or breaking down. Not that you've ever been to a track, as it's quite obvious that you spend more time trolling Mustang forums than you do actually driving your car. Of course, that about what is expected from a GT-R owner.

You were described in a previous post by another member, I'll give you a hint:

He posted a picture of a shirt.

Please see other cars in sig. I've owned more cars than years you've been alive. I've been here a bit longer than you, I own a mustang. I'm not cocky in the least bit. You just assume so becasue I have a GTR and assume I'm a dick to everyone, which isn't true.

 

[blk02edge]

Maybe if you'd being a cocky asshole and trolling about your GT-R, people might have a little more respect.

Your car can't destroy even 10% of the cars on their website, because your car can't make it around a track more than about one lap without overheating or breaking down. Not that you've ever been to a track, as it's quite obvious that you spend more time trolling Mustang forums than you do actually driving your car. Of course, that about what is expected from a GT-R owner.

You were described in a previous post by another member, I'll give you a hint:

He posted a picture of a shirt.

you should leave lol, you type with obvious rage and need a time out

 

[Sirraf]

To get back to OPs original post, I would go regular GT350 over the GT350R if your going Mustang. Considering it doesn't have alot of the creature comforts the base 350 would have unless you can add.

 

[Wildman113]

Please see other cars in sig. I've owned more cars than years you've been alive. I've been here a bit longer than you, I own a mustang. I'm not cocky in the least bit. You just assume so becasue I have a GTR and assume I'm a dick to everyone, which isn't true.

You have no idea how old I am or how many vehicles I've owned. Nice try though.

Your signature shows that you claim to own a GT500. Even if that was true, it doesn't give you an excuse to constantly troll about your GT-R and make outrageous, nonsense claims. You're a dick because that's who you are, you're a GT-R owner. It's not because of anything anyone has said, you're just sore that people aren't worshiping your overpriced Nissan.

It's quite apparent that all you want to do is come on and here try and get props for your GT-R. Its blatantly obvious, find a new hobby.

 

[Sirraf]

You have no idea how old I am or how many vehicles I've owned. Nice try though.

Your signature shows that you claim to own a GT500. Even if that was true, it doesn't give you an excuse to constantly troll about your GT-R and make outrageous, nonsense claims.

It's quite apparent that all you want to do is come on and here try and get props for your GT-R. Its blatantly obvious, find a new hobby.

Anything else?

Wildman, you have been hating on GTRs on this forum for years with your bullshit. I could pull up about 4 different threads with you on GTRs. Some guy with a GTR must have came over and watched netflix and chilled with your girl or something.